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Herxing on Less than Full Dose of Antibiotics

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Posted 6/30/2017 4:54 PM (GMT 0)
There are obviously optimal dosages for antibiotic (and herbal) treatments for Lyme and Co's.

My question is, if you herx on less than the optimal dose, doesn't that imply that the full dose is not yet necessary to have an impact?

I've been trying to add Bactrim/Septra to my protocol of Mepron and Zith in order to provide some Bartonella coverage while I treat Babesia. Ultimately, when I'm done with Mepron, we will move to Rifampin for Bart.

The original dose of Bactrim at 800mg x 2 per day caused an intense herx after a few days. My LLMD has thus decided to try 400 mg x 2 per day.

Given my initial herx, I decided to start at 1/2 that -- 200 mg x 2 per day -- and work up. After a couple of days, I am mildly herxing (and, yes, I am detoxing like crazy).

While 200 mg x 2 per day is not a dose that an LLMD would prescribe, is it not doing something if I'm herxing? That is, do we always have to be on the full dose of a medication or herb in order for it to have a positive impact?

I don't want to take 200mg x 2 per day of Bactrim for no reason, but it seems important to start there in order to get to the next level.

I'm curious what others' experiences are with this -- either on the ABX or herbal side.
Posted 6/30/2017 5:02 PM (GMT 0)
It definitely has an impact...but I would try to slowly increase to the required dose.

It may take you awhile... stay on the 200 mg x2 for a couple of weeks before increasing.

Have you thought about taking the full dose and pulse it instead of lowering the dose? Pulsing makes it more tolerable.
You said you herxed on the full dose after a few days. So how about trying full dose twice a week ...if that's fine...then do 3 X week.
Many LLMD's are having patients pulse their antibiotics.
Posted 6/30/2017 5:03 PM (GMT 0)
BTW - I find Bactrim really...really...difficult to take.


I get a severe increase in burning back pain...and it kind of freaks me out since I've read a lot about Bactrim and nasty effects.

Didn't help when Bluelyme said bactrim made his blood boil..after I'd looked up Stevens Johnson syndrome.shocked
Posted 6/30/2017 5:06 PM (GMT 0)
ABX: my llmd has never prescribed the higher doses that I have seen others are taking. But he also doesn't have me pulse them either. Just a different approach.

They have definitely been effective for me and caused herxing. I am 90% better than I was last Sept.

Herbals: I have never taken the full recommended dosages by Buhner. I have only worked up to just under about 1/2 of the dosages but taking around 13 different tinctures.

Again the herbals have helped in my healing too and caused herxing.

Take care, Jo
Posted 6/30/2017 5:12 PM (GMT 0)
Yes, the herxing indicates that it's killing off the bacteria. At low doses, the bacteria it's most likely killing off is all contained within the bloodstream, so there are still bacteria that are in the tissues that will need to be hit as well. That's why we use higher doses of things than for many other infections. The bacteria in the tissues must be treated or we relapse.
Posted 6/30/2017 5:15 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks Girlie and Jo.

I haven't discussed pulsing with my LLMD, but something to consider. I do appreciate the confirmation that lower doses than "standard" -- or, for instance, cited in Dr. B's Guidelines -- can help.

If I continue to struggle with the Bactrim, I will look to add an herbal for the Bart until I can move beyond the Mepron.
Posted 6/30/2017 5:21 PM (GMT 0)
Since I am taking lower than most for ABX I would bet that the Buhner protocols are really making the true difference in my healing then.


Just a thought.

I will continue working on increasing them.

Thanks to all of you guys to for the good information and thoughts. Sincerely, Jo
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