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Posted 2/9/2018 8:14 PM (GMT 0)
Hey everyone, an update from me.

My LLMD wants to take me off antibiotics before next meeting, 7th of March. She means that I'm ready and that all the herbs/supplements I'm taking will fix the rest.

I'm currently struggling with many itchy rashes in my face, brain fog, cold limbs(knees, feet and hands) and I really don't feel ready to get off the antibiotics.

According to LLMD I have Mycoplasma, Babesia, Bartonella, Strep(A) and Lyme. Coxs virus is also present according to test but cmv is not.

She noticed thrush on my tongue and suspected Candida, which I think have gotten much worse and hasn't been focused on enough.(High Glucose, Thrush, Brain fog, Rash. All symptoms of candida according to Dr. Horowitz)

She mentioned that Lyme, Bartonella and Babesia have all been debulked, but strep and mycoplasma have gotten worse.

Also I haven't heard a lot about the supplements/herbs I currently take, which I find very weird. She mentions that you can't clear the infection only through Buhner's procotol and the herbs are too weak.

She's telling that these herbs/supplements are the best that she's selling from her store. But they're pretty expensive.

Monopure 1300, Bio Allay, Tf L+, Pro Biomax 350, Perilla Pearls and ADP from her store. Additional from amazon are vitamin A, B5,B6,B-active, D3, E. Other supplements I'm buying off amazon are magnesium malate, milk thistle, curamin/Reservetrol.

I'm functioning pretty good, tough exercise 3x a week but I was also okay, maybe even a bit better when I was on Buhner's and antibiotics and not all the other stuff.

With all this stuff, would it be wise for me to stop the antibiotics? I really REALLY want to trust her, but this is my life at risk.

She mentions that she can fix me before I go back to Denmark in August, which is amazing to hear, but also almost too good to be true...

This ended up being a long post, if you have knowledge on one of the things, please comment, it's greatly appreciated!
Posted 2/9/2018 9:10 PM (GMT 0)
How long did you treat?

And how long were you sick before you started?


How was your babesia treated?

(sorry for all the questions)
Posted 2/9/2018 9:48 PM (GMT 0)
I have been with my llmd since mid October but didn’t start the actual treatment until end of November. I have been on Buhner since August

Compared to other lyme patients I have been surprisingly well over the years. I had injuries that occurred from lyme but other than that I didn’t have any severe symptoms. Only last year after being bedridden from a flu, it felt like everything started.

Muscle twitches, pain behind eye, brain fog etc.

I have felt hot a couple of times, but other than that I haven’t shown big symptoms of babesia.

The antibiotics I have been on are omnicef, doxycycline, Zithromax. We only found out for sure about babesia(according to llmd) that I have babesia and bartonella. But she says that they’re all drilled, so I guess we haven’t targeted a babesia treatment.
Posted 2/9/2018 9:50 PM (GMT 0)
I think it occurred in 2012 or 2014. But as I said, I have been doing amazing up until mid 2017.

It is greatly appreciated Girlie, ask as many questions as possible!
Posted 2/9/2018 10:39 PM (GMT 0)

Chris12321 said...
I have been with my llmd since mid October but didn’t start the actual treatment until end of November. I have been on Buhner since August

Compared to other lyme patients I have been surprisingly well over the years. I had injuries that occurred from lyme but other than that I didn’t have any severe symptoms. Only last year after being bedridden from a flu, it felt like everything started.

Muscle twitches, pain behind eye, brain fog etc.

I have felt hot a couple of times, but other than that I haven’t shown big symptoms of babesia.

The antibiotics I have been on are omnicef, doxycycline, Zithromax. We only found out for sure about babesia(according to llmd) that I have babesia and bartonella. But she says that they’re all drilled, so I guess we haven’t targeted a babesia treatment.

Well, I wouldn't stop treatment if you haven't addressed babs and bart effectively. Unless you are symptom free. You need an anti-malarial type med for babs. (mepron or malarone are most commonly used)
Were babs and bart a clinical diagnosis...or testing showed it?
Posted 2/9/2018 11:06 PM (GMT 0)
I agree, I wouldn’t stop either. But I’m still in a lot of herbs and supplements , so it’s a antibiotics break

Both were clinical, I have had white horizontal stretch marks and cramping in soles(bart) and I have been hot a couple of times, and a little nights sweat in the summer, with a pretty hot room

So you don’t think the herbs are enough, when I’m in my current state?
Posted 2/10/2018 12:06 AM (GMT 0)

Chris12321 said...
I agree, I wouldn’t stop either. But I’m still in a lot of herbs and supplements , so it’s a antibiotics break

Both were clinical, I have had white horizontal stretch marks and cramping in soles(bart) and I have been hot a couple of times, and a little nights sweat in the summer, with a pretty hot room

So you don’t think the herbs are enough, when I’m in my current state?

If you do switch to herbs - make sure you cover Bart and Babs - I would start the herbs soon - it will take a while to add them in and titrate up.
Many people do well on herbs.
Posted 2/10/2018 12:09 AM (GMT 0)
My llmd mentioned folliculitis as the cause of my rashes, but rashes doesn’t look like it.
And the foggy-ness and thrush makes me very suspicious, that all my current symptoms is Candida.
As I mentioned as well my glucose was also pretty high...

She mentioned it in December, right around when the rashes started to get really bad.
Posted 2/10/2018 12:12 AM (GMT 0)
Sounds like bart but I'm not so sure about babs. Hard to say you have babesia from a few sweats in hot room. But you do say you are cold, so that could be temperature dysregulation.

Taking a break, especially if you have candida, is probably a smart idea. Plus you have the herbs on board. Are you taking a good probiotic? You may need diflucan or pure nystatin to combat the yeast.

As for the supplements - looks like one is transfer factor lyme plus and I noticed a few Xymogen products. I am not sure if this is enough to be considered a herbal protocol. I could be wrong though - I never took transfer factor. Do you think she would be open to letting you add the buhner herbs back in? If you felt good on them that is what I would do.
Posted 2/10/2018 12:51 AM (GMT 0)
What you currently listed - is that your herbal treatment?

If so, I'm thinking the same as k07 - Add some buhner herbs in as well.
Posted 2/10/2018 1:06 AM (GMT 0)
Yes, those are all my herbs.

I have always trusted Stephen, so I asked my LLMD about taking his herbs. She didn't mind, but "at this point, it wouldn't do much good. Her herbs are much more strong." But I'm taking Andrographis 3x a day at a low dose, as well as cat's claw from time to time. I have run out of Astragalus, but I have considered getting more.
Posted 2/10/2018 1:11 AM (GMT 0)
Exactly. I'm taking the best probiotic called Pro Biomax 350. It's crazy expensive, 14 days for $100 so I'm taking it every 2. day.

Otherwise it's pretty decent probiotics.

I agree k07, I forgot to tell, that was her intention as well, before the candida gets really bad.

So you know these products? Because I have searched for other people taking it, but couldn't find many... I hope it's good compared to the price.
Posted 2/10/2018 1:36 AM (GMT 0)

Chris12321 said...
Exactly. I'm taking the best probiotic called Pro Biomax 350. It's crazy expensive, 14 days for $100 so I'm taking it every 2. day.

Otherwise it's pretty decent probiotics.

I agree k07, I forgot to tell, that was her intention as well, before the candida gets really bad.

So you know these products? Because I have searched for other people taking it, but couldn't find many... I hope it's good compared to the price.

I took a quick look at your supplements - what in particular is she saying will be for bart and/or babs?
Re: Buhner herbs...I would add in bart...and then babs...maybe mycoplasma...as well.
Posted 2/10/2018 1:57 AM (GMT 0)
I think taking breaks and then eventually stop taking ABX is the way to go at some point in time, for a person can't take ABX forever.

But the huge question is when is that time? People can debate that forever.

I didn't stop taking ABX until I reached what I felt was 70-80% well. ABX is a powerful punch to lyme, while herbs are little jabs.

But after you throw several haymakers at lyme (ABX) at some point moving to "Death by a thousand jabs" will have to come into the equation at some point.

Your LLMD is wrong if he or she in fact stated that herbs will not work (as if it's an absolute fact). What I hope they meant was it's much slower.

It's thousand little jabs at lyme and lyme herbal protocols are supposed change your biological functions (for the better). Biological changes by nature are slow (but happens).

A person doesn't go from overweight to ripped after only a few months of working out. A smoker's lungs doesn't clear up and get a lot healthier in a just a few months. A torn ACL takes several months to over a year to fully recover, etc.

When you are dealing with changing and repairing biology on a cellular level through herbs you have to look at it the same way. 1-2-3 years, to make a biological transformation.
Posted 2/10/2018 3:18 AM (GMT 0)
Keep in mind that milk thistle interferes with Mepron and Malarone, the meds used to treat babesia. If you do start either of these down the line, you can take dandelion root instead of milk thistle to support the liver.

If you have time and energy, making your own kefir is a fantastic way to get living probiotics. It costs what the milk does. It needs to be made from real kefir grains, not the powder stuff sold in health food stores. The grains are available online. I managed to get some from a cheese maker at a farmers market. Youtube has tutorials. Easy to do.

Our LLMD didn't think it would be a problem when our daughter took a 6 week break from antibiotics. We were all nervous about it but she didn't get worse. She resumed them again afterwards.
Posted 2/10/2018 4:10 AM (GMT 0)
I so dislike a doctor telling me that their herbs are the best and I HAVE to buy from them.

That is such a huge red flag for me.

Sorry, I just had to comment on this.
Posted 2/10/2018 4:48 PM (GMT 0)

Chris12321 said...
Yes, those are all my herbs.

I have always trusted Stephen, so I asked my LLMD about taking his herbs. She didn't mind, but "at this point, it wouldn't do much good. Her herbs are much more strong." But I'm taking Andrographis 3x a day at a low dose, as well as cat's claw from time to time. I have run out of Astragalus, but I have considered getting more.

I trust Buhner's, too. He has said that if people do nothing else in his protocols to at least do Japanese knotweed, even with abx. I didn't see that in your list. You did mention resveratrol in your initial post, but I personally would not trust in that. I would only use Japanese knotweed, preferably whole herb from one of Buhner's trusted sources.
Posted 2/10/2018 6:20 PM (GMT 0)
So many great responses, thank you so much!

Girlie: The thing is, she mentions that my babs, bart and lyme are not very present at the moment. So she is not so worried about it. She mentions that she can get rid of it all, maybe not the strep, but everything else. If I continue on her list of herbs. But I agree and I already have some of buhner's protocol for co-infections, so I wouldn't mind taking them as well to be sure. Money is only an object, I just want my life back.

The thing is, I don't feel so sick. I have been at points where I'm 95% well, and that is after probably 3-5 years of undiagnosed lyme+co. Which sounds very weird to me. I'm glad not that sick of course! But it kinda tells me that either I have had a superior immun system, that has kept every infection at bay. Or it tells me that I don't have as many co-infection as she states.

Dacarte3. In the beginning she stated that antibiotics is necessary, which is pretty much true. A lot of people do best on herbs AND antibiotics. Especially Buhner's. But she's saying that they wouldn't be strong enough to kill the lyme and co-infections completely. I somehow disagree with that, especially when so many have gotten healed from Buhner's.

B99, I will start to look into it! I have a lot of free time and I feel pretty good, so I am in for some cheap alternatives

PeteZa I absolutely agree! I the beginning she was referring to her shop, now she tells me that I have to buy some of them and some other's I can buy on amazon. I think I bought 5 products for $300, almost as much as the consultation itself. So both me and my wallet were very depressed after we left the clinic.

WalkingbyFaith, I have heard so much good from JK, but I haven't been responding that good on it unfortunately. I got a very upset stomach. But maybe back then, I didn't take any probiotics? Hmm... maybe I'll give it another shot, but once again. The LLMD told me not to start on JK again. Because of my response
Posted 2/10/2018 7:41 PM (GMT 0)
That’s good to hear, 1000Daisies!! Hopefully my llmd knows that as well... I had muscle twitches in my left leg 5 days prior to abc. It lasted for 30 min and came back the day after. Which was scary because it had never been that serious. The twitches stopped the day after the abc started.

It could have been from the bart, so that’s why the lyme protocol didn’t do the trick
Posted 2/11/2018 3:41 PM (GMT 0)
Hey Chris I really appreciate and enjoy reading your updates. I'm kinda like you I am able to exercise and function most days and work a full time job. And like you, I was never super sick. Don't get me wrong my symptoms were definitely impacting my life significantly, but I was never house or bed bound.

I am hovering at 80-90% recovered and also am a little unsure of the best route to take.

My LLMD says twitching needs to be gone two months before stopping abx. Every antibiotic break I have taken has resulted in severe twitching about 8-10 days into the break.

Right now I'm on Minocycline and I have added a simple herbal blend (Samsara Tick Recovery) Jap Knot, Sida Acuda, Houttyuna, etc blend.

Like you, I am also suspicious of Bart too. I am going to be starting Rifampin in a couple weeks.

Regarding your topic headline of trusting your LLMD... It's hard to do isn't it? I am a skeptical, scientific minded person by nature. Sometimes I have difficulty trusting my LLMD, but at the end of the day, I do trust we are on the right path.

It sounds like your LLMD is on the same track as mine, which may serve as some kind of validation for you. I am not sure about the herbs/supplements they sell. I would be super skeptical if they said they have proprietary or exclusive products in the LLMD office.
Posted 2/14/2018 2:47 AM (GMT 0)
Hi Missouri, thanks for the response!

That’s good to know, I’m really looking forward to the break to see where I stand.

You’re right I don’t have much of a choice at this point but I definitely have some questions for her at the next meeting.

Once again, thank you all for your contribution, it means a lot!
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