For those taking Disulfurim: this might help with the side effects.

Okay so doing some research on this drug and how it works has been interesting. DSF (Disulfurim) original purpose was to help alcoholics stop drinking since it cripples the body's ability to break down acetaldehyde, which is greatly increased in the body after drinking alcohol. So when you take this drug and drink you feel AWFUL due to the crazy high amount of acetaldehyde. I have a suspicion that at least some of the side effects from this drug are not the results of herxing, but rather a result of the build up of acetaldehyde in the body.

This talks about how the drug most likely works.

Somebody said...
The data in Fig. 2 further indicates that DSF inhibits the in vitro growth of S. aureus in a time- and dose-dependent manner. The immediate deceleration in growth on treatment is attributed to the rapid cleavage of DSF by thiophilic residues in proteins, metabolites, and cofactors, which is hypothesized to instigate an abrupt halt in metabolism. A similar mechanism of action is proposed for allicin and alike electrophilic disulfides (17). Upon cleavage of DSF, the mix disulfide product may further participate in a second thiol-disulfide exchange reaction with another endogenous thiol yielding a disulfide and DDTC. Based on the reaction profile of thiuram disulfides, thiol-disulfide exchange is expected to occur with cellular glutathione. Accordingly, the introduction of glutathione in the growth medium caused a 2-fold increase in the MICs of THM and DSF (Table 4). The antagonistic effect observed with glutathione, which is found in high abundance in Gram-negative bacteria but not in Gram-positive bacteria (7), is believed to account for the narrow activity spectrum of THM and DSF.

https://aac.asm.org/content/61/9/e00898-17

Now, what about the high levels of acetaldehyde that taking DSF causes? Can those be addressed? Yes.

First think is taking some taurine. Taurine boosts liver function and helps it break down acetaldehyde

Secondly get you some Dihydromyricetin. Ever heard of the "Asian flush"? It happens when some Asian pople drink alchol due to the inability to break down acetaldehyde. Dihydromyricetin works like this

Somebody said...


Dihydromyricetin (DHM) increases the ability of two key enzymes to function. These enzymes are alcohol dehydrogenase (ADH) and acetaldehyde dehydrogenase (ALDH). The enzyme ADH is responsible for breaking down alcohol into acetaldehyde and the enzyme ALDH breaks down acetaldehyde into acetic acid.

By enhancing these enzymes DHM allows you to flush both alcohol and more importantly acetaldehyde out of your system at a quicker rate. This leads to less hangover symptoms the following morning.

So DSF increases acetaldehyde levels, but Dihydromyricetin clears out acetaldehyde from your system. As such it may very well lessen the side effects of DSF. Dihydromyricetin is easily available as a supplement on amazon.

So if anyone tries this post up and let us know how it goes. You also might want to ask your Doctor about taking any of these supplements. Understand this is amateur research, there is no guarantee it will work and could even cause you upset, who knows?

Post Edited (Lapis_29) : 7/14/2019 9:04:04 AM (GMT-6)

Molybdenum too

Good point benfast. I posted this link in the DSF group on Fb last night and someone tried the taurine plus also ornithine and it really helped them immensely with side-effects/herx reactions. Good info here.

benfast said...
An increase in MIC actually means that it is decreasing in effectiveness ie the minimum inhibitory concentration doubles, so glutathione makes it less effective.

yeah great point, I was not reading that correctly. I edited my post.

Lapis,

From the results of the OAT test and MycoTox tests I just had done, I have high arabinose indicating yeast overgrowth (or mold??) and high lactic acid from bad bacteria.

I have had chemical sensitivities for a long time. A long time ago, I read something that made me wonder if acetaldehyde could be involved in my MCS. Georgia Hunter agreed it could be, since yeast produce it.

You said to deal with acetaldehyde:

“First think is taking some taurine. Taurine boosts liver function and helps it break down acetaldehyde

Secondly get you some Dihydromyricetin.”

Should I try this for my MCS?

Where do you get these items, especially the 2nd one, which I never heard of. How much of each? How/when do I dose it? Any contraindications with other supplements or herbs?

Any suggestion where to source high quality Taurine and Dihydromyricetin?

Is there any concern that by enhancing acetaldehyde dehydrogenase with Dihydromyricetin (the enzyme DSF works to inhibit) we could actually be blunting DSF's activity against Lyme? (since we don't know the mechanism of how it works against Lyme)

Thanks!

Lymie24 said...
Any suggestion where to source high quality Taurine and Dihydromyricetin?

Is there any concern that by enhancing acetaldehyde dehydrogenase with Dihydromyricetin (the enzyme DSF works to inhibit) we could actually be blunting DSF's activity against Lyme? (since we don't know the mechanism of how it works against Lyme)

Thanks!

yeah great question. If you read the quote from the study I posted in the first post in this thread they speculate on several mechanisms and none of them have anything to do with acetaldehyde, so Dihydromyricetin theoretically should not interfere with its action. Having said that you might want to ask your doctor about it and see what they say.

I don't have a rec for DHM source, sorry. Pure Encapsulations has a good taurine supp.

sorry to hear that Lymie24. Hope you stabilize from it soon and the neuropathy fades out quickly.

Sebreg,

Thanks man. Just a bump in the road. I'll get past it.

carlnpa,

The first initial major herx lasted until around day 25. The toxicity from the acetaldehyde really started to get intense the last seven days or so. Between days 25-33 I felt really really good. I'm still struggling bad right now. I've been sleeping several days straight, lots of pain, and cognitive impairment. Once this passes I'll get a better idea of where I'm at. I can say confidently I wasn't done treating.

Nothing at all. I've ordered it. Just waiting for it to come in.

There must be something the Lymies have Bb, babesia, bart, some unknown antagonist, combos of bugs, that causes hard reaction to dsf.

Alks were and are taking large doses of dsf (up to several grams daily) without the apparent terrible side effects that are being reported by many.

I pray you can figure it out.

FWIW try an antihistamine for grins, diphenhydramine or loratadine.