HealingWell
Search Close Search
☰

Bartonella can't be cured?

Support Forums
>
Lyme Disease
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply
❬ ❬ Previous Thread |Next Thread ❭ ❭
Posted 9/19/2021 9:56 PM (GMT 0)
Hi guys. I'm working with a herbal practitioner now because I couldn't tolerate antibiotics anymore due to intestinal issues. She says bartonella never goes away and she's hesitant to say that it can be cured, but many people become symptom free for the rest of their lives and that I'll always have to manage my health to prevent bart from taking hold.
They will always hide out in dormancy and wait for the body to become weakened by lack of sleep, poor diet, stress, infection or trauma. Restoring health and maintaining good health can put bartonella into dormancy. It is not uncommon for flares to occur occasionally, but with less severity....I was so motivated to eradicate bart completely and get my health back with herbs, but I cried when I read that even though she said that bart doesn't have to be a debilitating disease forever. Getting rid of it completely is the goal and the hope that I hold onto tigthly and accepting less than that feels so pointless. I just need to get there somehow....or do I hold onto a wrong hope? Do you have some opinions from other practicioners or doctors or yourself for me?
Posted 9/19/2021 11:12 PM (GMT 0)
I personally know people who do not have any symptoms of Bart or any of the infections after finishing treatment. They are symptom free.
… years later.

I am almost symptom free now - and have been stretching the time off on my maintenance protocol.
ie only taking abx for one week every 5 weeks.
I stretched it to 8 weeks once as well.

I do not have a really restricted diet - I do take supplements.
I am back to work - after over 5 years off (6 years?)
Posted 9/19/2021 11:16 PM (GMT 0)
I’m not sure if that’s true of bartonella but I’ve heard dr J say after Lyme progresses to a certain point you can only push it into remission snd can’t actually completely eradicate it from your system.
Posted 9/19/2021 11:27 PM (GMT 0)
What you describe is my basic assumption at this point - the goal is to get infections into a dormant state, and bolster the systems of your body to handle stressors better, so those infections will stay dormant indefinitely. I have not heard anything that's convinced me that every last microbe from an infection can be eradicated, especially because we know how well they hide, morph, and evade testing. I believe that lasting remission can be achieved because the immune system can keep these (and many other) infections in check, as long as we keep the nervous system, microbiome, GI tract, nutrition, and stress levels generally healthy. Others definitely disagree about this, and I'm open to being wrong, but this characterization has been the most convincing from what I've observed.
Posted 9/20/2021 2:23 AM (GMT 0)
Bartonella I was able to eliminate with antibiotics. Lyme has been much more difficult.
Posted 9/20/2021 4:24 AM (GMT 0)
I’m hopeful that it’s “gone” and don’t have to be worried about it coming back if I for a period of time I get less sleep… or have extra stressors… etc.

I think if that was the case I’d have relapsed when I first went back to work - I was lacking sleep (trouble sleeping and up at 7:00 am), worried about the retraining on a difficult, fast paced job, had a boss who made it quite clear she didn’t want me there.
But I didn’t!

I am hopeful that I don’t have to worry about relapsing - if I haven’t already.
Fingers crossed.
Posted 9/20/2021 1:06 PM (GMT 0)
I think understanding expectations is key. There are lots of infections you’ve picked throughout your life that are still in your body but your immune system keeps them at bay - just about every viral infection you’ve ever had and some bacterial infections too.

You don’t need to eliminate every organism to be well although I’m sure it does happen for some individuals.

We live our entire lives surprising things that we’ve been exposed to and that’s the norm
Posted 9/20/2021 1:50 PM (GMT 0)
There are millions of people with Bartonella with no symptoms. The goal is to get back to being one of those millions of people.
Posted 9/20/2021 11:12 PM (GMT 0)
over 60% of ppl have bart, with no symptoms. over 75% have ebv and over 90% have cmv. and 99% have candida ...

define "cured". eliminate from the body? no you probably cannot. but why do you want that? bart acting up is a sign of immune dysfunction
Posted 9/21/2021 12:39 AM (GMT 0)
I believe that Dr. Mozayani, one of the top bartonella docs, treats until there is no evidence of bartonella on three separate occasions using Galaxy labs ePCR test (currently the most reliable test on the market, though to be fair, even this testing method is not perfect). So I think there is hope for it to be eliminated, however as swim15 says we do carry many organisms within our bodies without them wreaking havoc, so I would imagine that if one gets back to a state of healthy immune function, bartonella shouldn't cause the damage it does. Here's a success video from someone who treated with Dr. M in this way: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZI3v_D5ndpw
Posted 9/21/2021 9:23 AM (GMT 0)

morningstars said...
I believe that Dr. Mozayani, one of the top bartonella docs, treats until there is no evidence of bartonella on three separate occasions using Galaxy labs ePCR test (currently the most reliable test on the market, though to be fair, even this testing method is not perfect). So I think there is hope for it to be eliminated, however as swim15 says we do carry many organisms within our bodies without them wreaking havoc, so I would imagine that if one gets back to a state of healthy immune function, bartonella shouldn't cause the damage it does. Here's a success video from someone who treated with Dr. M in this way: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZI3v_D5ndpw

just to clarify - the Galaxy labs ePCR test is typically 3 blood draws - so are you saying he treats until 3 of those ( 3 separate tests each with 3 blood draws ) are clear - of just 1x 3 blood draws tested via ePCR

i ask because the test is only 49% sensitive according to Galaxy in their published paper - so no better than a coin toss - so a single 3 run test would not seem to tell Dr M much

costs is also $1600 per 3 draw run - so quickly adds up
Posted 9/21/2021 12:17 PM (GMT 0)
See Swim15's post above. The goal isn't to eliminate them all, it is to feel better. You have more pathogens than just bartonella and they are more of a problem IMO.
Posted 9/21/2021 2:11 PM (GMT 0)
Dr K believes eliminating every last pathogen in a chronic setting is very difficult/near impossible. He thinks it just because autoimmune, in a sense, at that point. That’s why he likes IVIG, goal is to calm the immune system and feel better
Posted 9/22/2021 11:38 AM (GMT 0)
I say, don't worry about it. I had Bart, 2x Babesia, Hashimotos, Candida, and EBV. When I started feeling better and going back to school and work - taking the train and walking long distances like a normal human - I had the inclination to get re-tested and look at viral load. Nope. I felt better, so what's the point? Part of how I got better was believing I could and reading success stories. Everyday, I told myself, "I feel great!" (even when I didn't). I started trying my best to act like a healthy person, thinking like a healthy person, and doing things healthy people do. I had to read articles on how to be healthy. LOL. It was a slow journey, but the mindset is one of the biggest elements to healing. You have to believe you'll get better.

I don't think I'll ever get retested. I don't care about viral load. I care about how I feel and I feel awesome. Sure, I have bad days and occasionally I wonder if I'm getting sick again, but I have to shake it off and remember how far I've come.
Posted 9/22/2021 4:58 PM (GMT 0)

skinny_joe said...
There are millions of people with Bartonella with no symptoms. The goal is to get back to being one of those millions of people.

I do wonder if I had bart since a child (due to many cats scratches/bites) but my immune system was keeping it in check - and then during a stressful time in my life plus possibly a tick bite it became active.

Even though I seemed to be a healthy child/teen for the most part - there were a few anomalies - (raised bilirubin, feeling sick most mornings if I didn’t get enough sleep, and the unexplained thinning of my hair as a teen.

I was diagnosed in 2014 - symptoms started with frozen shoulder and then continued.
Posted 9/23/2021 12:54 AM (GMT 0)
Girlie, Same - I got scratched by a cat (or two) when I was young and looking back, it's only now I see WHY i was the only 9 year old who got migraines, couldn't be out in the sun for long periods of time, nose bleeds, and was constantly throwing up. They just called me "the sick one" and I never saw a doctor for it. I also had very heavy periods and pretty bad depression as a teen. I had "stomach problems" in high school. Like, honestly, if my kid was having migraines, nose bleeds, throwing up all the time, I'd probably worry a little bit - don't you think? Yeah, my parents didn't worry too much. Hence 20+ year of just feeling like crap for "no reason" and seeing a million doctors and being told I was "being dramatic." Yikes.
Posted 9/23/2021 1:28 AM (GMT 0)
Yah - my parents weren’t very concerned back in the 70’s.. lol.

If I followed their ways - my son would likely still not have the Celiac disgnosis - and be continuing to damage his intestines.
Posted 10/3/2021 4:43 PM (GMT 0)
Thank you so much for your responses everyone! It's a huge help for me. You guys are the best and I wish you all the very best. Big hugs to you all smile
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply