Clarity on why Dr Jemsek treats all his patients for Babesia

this intrigued me as the guy makes a lot of sense in many other respects - but i never really got to the bottom of why he thinks all his patients have Babesia - so had some difficulty accepting it.

i was watching this presentation given in London in 2016
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukdanbxsbb4

around the half way mark he describes his initial trials of using xylitol as a biofilm agent (after finding out about its effective use in wound infections in a Montana hospital) in only small amounts and in around 30 of his better functioning and stable lyme patients around 3 years prior to the preso - so 2013ish

apparently, to his surprise they all reported feeling much worse, were alarmed and frustrated and asked "what the hell have you done to me"
on examination they all had swollen liver and spleens (symptoms Jemsek associates with Babesia infection) - and since Babesia is documented to live in biofilms created by other organisms - in his mind this meant that the patients had hidden infections with Babesia species - even if they had no prior symptoms and so from this point on he always treats Babesia first and says that too many times when he has not done so the patient fails treatment or relapses.

i must admit this is not quite the definitive proof we might like - but at least it explains his thought process

i should add that i would describe myself as stable and functioning chronic lyme patient and i also had a dramatic flare of symptoms after only 4 days at 2g xylitol a day ( approx 1/4 of full dose on Jemsek protocols ) - including pain around my liver area

so does this mean i have Babesia ? or is this from lyme / mixed co-infections

just thought i would post in case its of interest to others trying to figure this stuff out

When you see Dr J in person - he does an extensive physical exam which includes palpating your lower abdomen to feel for swelling.

He also insists on extensive blood work done after the initial appointment.

He’s been treating patients for many years and I would think that part of his protocols have been devised based on trends he sees (responses to different regimens) in his patients.
ie herxing and symptom relief after on certain protocols.)

sandyfeet said...


If it’s dissolving biofilm I would expect it would provoke symptoms regardless since you’re releasing bacteria that were happily confined to one area would you not?
.

possibly - but i guess it depends on what the immune system is doing

the other thread we had on herxhiemer reactions found that the reason for the herx reaction is actually the bacteria that are slowed down or damaged but not killed by antibiotics/antimicrobials getting eaten ( phagocytosis ) by white blood cells and then the live bacteria inside the white blood cells trigger the white blood cells to release lost of inflammatory cytokines - which drive the herx reaction

so if the bacteria are disrupted from biofilms but still fully functioning the immune system might not have such and easy time mopping them up - and the herx may be much less

just trying to extrapolate from the theory / facts we know so far - i have never tried biofilm agents without antimicrobials before so i cant speak from personal experience

I was highly positive on Cunningham panel as well. I suspect many of us in here w/ neuro symptoms are. I'm on SCIG (subcutaneous IVIG). What dr prescribed IVIG for you?

hey Jason - thanks for sharing that

it is hard to figure when as you say there is more than one credible theory from respected LLMD's

when i have heard Dr SP speak about herx and blebs i also found it plausible - but as i understand it he is relating a personal theory based on reasoning - along the following lines:

"how many pathogens can i have left after treating continuously for 9 months with incredible herxes all the while - therefore must not be killing pathogens - they must just be stressed and leaving blebs everywhere when stimulated by antibiotics"

there are definitely scientific references for lyme producing blebs - and possibly other bacteria ( i have not checked ) - but i get the impression he is simply theorising on the rest to join the dots.

the Jernigan article did actually list scientific papers detailing the herx reaction link to phagocytosis of live bacteria so while i do believe blebbing is a real phenomenon - i am at this point leaning more towards the live bacteria inside macrophages explanation - or poss. a bit of both.

ref babesia - i think there is recent research that shows even if it doesnt make its own biofilm - its perfectly capable of co-habiting in biofilms created by other organisms and also fibrin deposits ( bart stimulates lots of that ) there was talk of babesia organisms in "fibrin nests" - maybe it stimulates it own fibrin deposits which seems feasible as fibrin is generated by inflammation and babsia can certainly do that.

ref the T-Labs babesia test - i did not see that have a babesia test.
i assume its another florescent tag and con-focal laser microscopy type test - similar to their bart one
do you know if they have published any thing on its specificity ( how many species it is known to successfully bind to )
i would be very interested to see a copy of the slide/report if you would not mind sharing

reason being i became ill after being bitten by 10 or 12 horse flies in a swarm - which does not fit well with lyme - but could fit better with babesia or bartonella ( could of course have had underlying lyme for years before ) and have been doing my own microscopy experiments since - see my babesia / microscopy thread

Post Edited (Garzie) : 1/18/2022 4:38:26 AM (GMT-7)