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Posted 2/17/2022 9:11 PM (GMT 0)
Myself and my spouse have been put on azithromycin for Lyme, Bart, and babesia. This is following several years of worsening symptoms that are seemingly resistant to treatment.
In the past few weeks of taking it, not only has there been little to no noticeable effect from the abx, but we are both continuing a steady decline in health that has been happening before the abx. My spouse in particular is noticing the “dimmer switch getting turned down.” He’s experienced a increasingly reduce loss of energy, ability, and cognitive function, plus light headed ness, dizziness, and shortness of breath.

This has all happened before and he’s gotten perilously close to complete system shutdown. It has only been a big intervention like stem cells or an expensive IV ozone treatment that gave him a temporary boost. At the moment, we can’t do either and are waiting for an appointment soon from our LLMD to determine a course of action.

I’m just wondering if anyone else can relate and what would be suggestions to either pursue or bring up to our doctor.
Posted 2/18/2022 4:24 AM (GMT 0)
“ Myself and my spouse have been put on azithromycin for Lyme, Bart, and babesia. This is following several years of worsening symptoms that are seemingly resistant to treatment. “

Just Azithromycin?
Should be on two or more abx at a time.
Posted 2/18/2022 10:38 AM (GMT 0)
yep - sounds like herx like reactions to me

i also had worsening for 6weeks to 2 months on abx before v gradual improvements started - imperceptibly at first

also agree with more than a single abx needed - especially for multiple infections ( most people with Lyme and co )
Posted 2/18/2022 3:26 PM (GMT 0)

Girlie said...
“ Myself and my spouse have been put on azithromycin for Lyme, Bart, and babesia. This is following several years of worsening symptoms that are seemingly resistant to treatment. “

Just Azithromycin?
Should be on two or more abx at a time.

Yes, I thought so too! Apparently he wanted to wait and see how we react for a month before trying doxy.
Posted 2/18/2022 4:39 PM (GMT 0)

Canary63 said...

Girlie said...
“ Myself and my spouse have been put on azithromycin for Lyme, Bart, and babesia. This is following several years of worsening symptoms that are seemingly resistant to treatment. “

Just Azithromycin?
Should be on two or more abx at a time.

Yes, I thought so too! Apparently he wanted to wait and see how we react for a month before trying doxy.

////////////////////////////////

That makes sense.
Posted 2/18/2022 5:27 PM (GMT 0)
I would encourage you and your spouse to either start detoxing heavily or increase your detoxing. It's normal to have an increase in symptoms when starting treatments, increasing a dose, or adding in another "killing'' agent. This is known as the Jarrisch-Herxheimer Reaction, commonly called a "herx" in most Lyme communities. Detoxing is the only way out of that situation.

I tried antibiotic treatment first, and my body started shutting down eventually, but not until after I experienced disturbing symptoms like seizures, very severe anxiety, and so much more. Detoxing pulled me out of that so I could entertain finding treatment again.
Posted 2/18/2022 5:40 PM (GMT 0)

Traveler said...
I would encourage you and your spouse to either start detoxing heavily or increase your detoxing. It's normal to have an increase in symptoms when starting treatments, increasing a dose, or adding in another "killing'' agent. This is known as the Jarrisch-Herxheimer Reaction, commonly called a "herx" in most Lyme communities. Detoxing is the only way out of that situation.

I tried antibiotic treatment first, and my body started shutting down eventually, but not until after I experienced disturbing symptoms like seizures, very severe anxiety, and so much more. Detoxing pulled me out of that so I could entertain finding treatment again.

I totally agree! We are trying to detox as much as possible with the following:
Vitamin c
NAC
Coffee enemas
Glutathione nebulizer
Infrared sauna
Hyperbaric oxygen chamber
Dry brushing
Activated charcoal
Lemon water
Biocidin
Drinking baking soda and salt water
Magnesium foot baths
Cistus incanus tea
Gentle walks every day
Gentle exercise a few times a week
Oil pulls
No sugar
Probiotics/fermented foods

this is in addition to eating organic foods, grass fed meats, wild caught fish, filtered water, non toxic detergents, cleaners, soaps, etc.
Posted 2/18/2022 6:57 PM (GMT 0)
Wow - LOL - that looks a lot like the way my detox list did! I had to heavily detox the whole time I was in treatment. Good for you both!

Now, a few thoughts - Cistus incanus would be more of a treatment than a detox method - just so you know. I had a ton of troubles tolerating it due to its effect on every infection I had all at once. It's an awesome herb, just be careful in timing its use.

Is it possible you are "over-detoxing"? Too much of a good thing isn't always a good thing. I found out that I could definitely detox too aggressively at times, and had to back down for a bit before ramping back up again. How can you detox too aggressively? Remember that detoxing releases toxins from where they are bound, so if a person detoxes too aggressively, they release more toxins than the body can clear without increasing symptoms - sometimes very dramatically, depending on their situation. This is only something that you/your spouse, and your LLMD can evaluate, so I'm just bringing it up as a thought, but something that often needs to be considered when a person is detoxing heavily.

If this is what's happening though, you will need to slow both treatments, as well as your detoxing, temporarily in order to allow the body to play catch up.

Hoping this isn't what's happening, but know that it's still something that can be dealt with if it is!
Best of luck!! Please keep us posted on how you are both doing!
Posted 2/18/2022 10:07 PM (GMT 0)

Traveler said...
Wow - LOL - that looks a lot like the way my detox list did! I had to heavily detox the whole time I was in treatment. Good for you both!

Now, a few thoughts - Cistus incanus would be more of a treatment than a detox method - just so you know. I had a ton of troubles tolerating it due to its effect on every infection I had all at once. It's an awesome herb, just be careful in timing its use.

Is it possible you are "over-detoxing"? Too much of a good thing isn't always a good thing. I found out that I could definitely detox too aggressively at times, and had to back down for a bit before ramping back up again. How can you detox too aggressively? Remember that detoxing releases toxins from where they are bound, so if a person detoxes too aggressively, they release more toxins than the body can clear without increasing symptoms - sometimes very dramatically, depending on their situation. This is only something that you/your spouse, and your LLMD can evaluate, so I'm just bringing it up as a thought, but something that often needs to be considered when a person is detoxing heavily.

If this is what's happening though, you will need to slow both treatments, as well as your detoxing, temporarily in order to allow the body to play catch up.

Hoping this isn't what's happening, but know that it's still something that can be dealt with if it is!
Best of luck!! Please keep us posted on how you are both doing!

Hahaha us Lymies live in our own world with extensive detox as part of daily life.
Thanks so much for the encouragement and guidance! Good call on the cistus tea! That’s flown under the radar and I think I need to back off. Same with re-evaluating the detox I currently do.

Take care!
Posted 2/18/2022 10:16 PM (GMT 0)
"us Lymies live in our own world with extensive detox as part of daily life"

Boy, howdy! You said it. But, it's something that becomes very necessary for a lot of us!

At least I was able to help with some thought-provoking ideas. This forum can be great for that!

Best of luck, and please let us know how you both are doing!
Posted 2/19/2022 3:12 PM (GMT 0)

Breezzy said...
NAC - has antibacterial properties as well as biofilm disrupting. I mildly herxed every time I took it. It's also a precursor to glutathione so a recommendation I received was stop nac or reduce to sprinkles and just take liposomal glutathione. Definitely helped.

Infrared sauna - Can leave me a little herxy when I overdo it which could be a matter of minutes. If I forget to take electrolytes and/or rehydrate afterwards I feel sluggish
Biocidin - caused me to herx

Drinking baking soda and salt water
Magnesium foot baths

Cistus incanus tea - same experience as Traveler this stuff packs a punch even on

Probiotics/fermented foods - certain probiotics messed with me in a mcas brain fog way so play around. Fermented foods while amazing they are high in histamine and they mcas'd me which I didn't realize for a long time. They can also be problematic with candida/fungus/mold overgrowth. I had to test/eliminate a few things before I got some relief.

I eventually reintroduced all that I put on hold. You have great options in your list so hang in there.

This was so helpful! I just started doing NAC more regularly and i haven’t considered its effect. I’ll back off. I know in the past, I used to get horrific anxiety from it; that’s not happening but whose to say other herx isn’t still taking place?

For the sauna, yes, I’m glad someone else understands! I can only do it once a week, max, for like 15 minutes or it makes me feel horrible.

Ok hmm, good point on the fermented foods. Again, I used to have very strong reactions taking it in past and was relieved those didn’t show up this time. But they could still be affecting me at a lower level. I’ll back off for a couple days and see.
Did you have the same problem with yogurt? I’ve been doing coconut yogurt for the past few weeks.
Posted 2/19/2022 7:31 PM (GMT 0)

Breezzy said...
Yes to the yogurt. I made matsoni (mesothilic yogurt) for quite some time. To be honest I used a2 milk and goat but I didn't try coconut. Since the coconut doesn't have casein-non-dairy it might be a good option. Thanks for sharing the coconut option bc the probiotic and prebiotic numbers you can obtain from ferments are unmatched. I've been waiting what feels like forever to reintroduce.

One more thought that I realize isn't for everyone but homeopathic remedies helped me a lot with detox. Drainage, lymph, liver, kidney remedies and not necessarily all at once. Brands like energetix, des bio, and beyond balance are good options to consider.[/quote

Ive been making my own coconut yogurt (I’m super lactose and casein intolerant). It’s really easy and I’ve been making it in an Instant Pot.
Ive been pleasantly surprised to see that if I had a spoonful or two after eating, it really reduces any bloating that usually shows up (hurray for chronic gut dysbiosis).
I do wonder how much it’s affecting me, though. I’ll chill on the sauerkraut for sure.

Ive never tried it even heard of those homeopathic remedies! Thank you so much. I’m going to check them out. I’m up for trying these new things.

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