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avoid manganese?

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Posted 5/30/2022 2:32 PM (GMT 0)
Borrelia survives on Manganese instead of iron.
Has anyone tried low/no intake of Manganese for killing Lyme? Does it work?

What is advised regarding supplements with Manganese?
Does taking any mount of Manganese feed borrelia?
Posted 5/30/2022 2:40 PM (GMT 0)
i read one anecdotal report of one person who believed they were controlling their symptoms by severe restriction of manganese - but i think they may have been operating more from a position of belief than science

yes borrelia's main anti-oxidant pathway seems to use manganese - but humans need manganese too and there is plenty of manganese in the human body for them to use.
this is consistent with most obligate parasitic pathogens getting what they need from their host so i think you would likely do yourself harm long before you killed off the borrelia.

if we could find something that blocked the particular enzyme that borrelia uses the manganese for - its likely that this would have less off target effects in humans as we have a different enzyme - and this could therefore be a viable drug development approach.

i think i recall reading that some people were theorizing that this may be the mechanism by which disulfiram works - but i think it was conjecture only as that mechanism is so far unknown.

Post Edited (Garzie) : 5/30/2022 8:43:42 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/31/2022 12:40 PM (GMT 0)
Human mitochondria need manganese for the same reason as borrelia, you can't starve yourself of manganese without harm.

I had some success blocking the manganese transporter with claritin. This alone won't kill borrelia, as the bacteria will just try to acquire more manganese, but this makes borrelia come out of its dormant state and a little easier to kill with antibiotics.

The problem with claritin is that the antihistamine effect suppresses my immune system a bit, so I needed to take a break every now and then to allow my immune system to catch up with removing the dead bacteria.
Posted 5/31/2022 1:43 PM (GMT 0)
Para-aminosalicylic acid (PAS) is used for manganese toxicity. I think it causes like a ~30% reduction in blood level of manganese in just a few days but I can't find where I read that right now. It's related to aspirin but has a different chemical structure.

The brand name is Paser, it's normally used for tuberculosis.

I would just be worried about making the spirochetes dig in deeper searching for manganese. Although it's debatable if they can even get deeper into tissue for most of us, at this point.
Posted 5/31/2022 2:38 PM (GMT 0)
My experience has been the opposite. When deprived of manganese, the bacteria do not dig in deeper, they come out.
Posted 5/31/2022 4:14 PM (GMT 0)
I read once that the bugs are going to find food regardless of the intake.
Depriving a nutrient just further deprives your body of something the bugs are also eating. I don’t think there’s a sound strategy in starving the bugs that can’t be explained by some other mechanism actually deriving the benefit. I.E. keto is anti inflammatory and changes the way the mitochondria works, maybe a reduction in biofilm build up.. - not so much starving the bugs of carbs and sugars IMO.
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