effectivity of herbal treatment

Buhner's approach to Lyme was that there wasn't so far many / any good antimicrobial herbs for Lyme - and his approach is mainly focussed on reducing the cytokines triggered by Lyme and thereby give the body the edge to heal itself.

this seems to work for some people - but it didn't for me - at least not on its own ( i used all of his lyme herbs and all of his bartonella herbs plus a few more for 2+ years )
perhaps because i have bartonella as well as Lyme - as many of us do

i do think it helped move me forward a little though - perhaps 25% - reduced some symptoms - helped me get a bit stronger - which was very welcome at the time - but i was still a long way from cured / well
i still take some of his herbs for this reason

there have been some scientific studies in the lab that have shown direct antimicrobial activity of crude extracts of skullcap, knotweed and a few others when added directly to in test tubes with lyme bacteria cultured in them - but we do not know if these are representative of what occurs in our bodies when we consume these herbs or the concentrations achievable by doing so - as there are many steps and variable in between

artemisinin a semisynthetic derivative of artemisia annua ( a type of artemisia plant ) has shown some effectiveness against lyme spirochetes - esp when combined with other drugs - but this was not the herb but a chemical extracted from it - again in the lab in test tubes at high concentrations - not necessarily achievable from consuming the herb.

there is no harm in trying herbs to see if you are someone who will respond - but lyme treatment is a long haul affair - and if you were responding to abx before - and are now relapsing - i think the best advice may be to get back on abx to continue treatment and perhaps consider pulsing - which may allow you to eventually taper off by extending the periods between pulses as long as no relapse signs are occurring. rather than a sudden stop.

this approach also gives you a guide to how long you need to continue as you can gauge how much herx reaction you get to each pulse ( something is hard to do with continuous abx )

i hope its of some help

Bhava123 said...
Dear Garzie,

thank you again very much for your extensive and explanatory asnwer and also sharing your personal experience. I kind of have similiar - this year after taking Abx for say 6 - 8 weeks, I continued only with Buhner and after 2-3 weeks symptoms kept coming back. Most probably I will have to continue with pulsing, as you are suggesting. I will keep watching symptoms and how things unfold...

To your knowledge, I taking tea from Artemisia absinthium, do you know if there is the active substance that might work against lyme, in it too, or is it only in artemisia annua?

Best wishes
B

Hi Bhava
i recall reading some papers on extraction methods and chemical constituents for artemisia species.
they were mainly focussed on the artemisinin type components that were used for malaria treatment ( and have since been used for Babesia since Babesia is related to malaria )

and i have since seen papers showing artemisinin is somewhat effective against lyme spirochetes when used in combinations with other antibiotics / antimicrobials

as i recall, in those papers only artemisia annua had effective levels of artemisinin compounds for malaria ( malaria organisms are extremely sensitive to it ) - but it was hard to extract - as it was not very water soluble and is easily damaged by heat and air
it is fat soluble - so the original Chinese medicine recipe for using the herb described pouring hot milk over pulverised fresh herb.
i think there was some use as a tea also - but i think it was weaker

of course this is all focussing on artemisinin - or its naturally occurring analogues - as these are the most researched compound sin the plant - but its possible there may be different chemicals present in artemisia absinthium that are active for borrelia - but i have not seen any papers on that.

i think there are probably better candidates for targeting lyme.
cryptolepis is one option that does have studies to support its use against borrelia - and has activity for bartonella and Babesia also
it can be taken as a tea - but the water needs to be acidified to aid extraction - eg add lemon juice or vinegar

hi Pickles

do you mean artemisia the herb - or artemisinin the pharma drug?

if i recall correctly artemisinin is the semisynthetic drug made from artemisia with the specific purpose of making it water soluble so it can be used in standard tablet form

i don't know exactly how much artemisinin is absorbed when its taken orally - but i would guess that its enough so that liposomal formulations are not required - as its already designed to be pretty water soluble

but if you are referring to some form of alcoholic or solvent herbal extract that is then made into a liposomal formulation - then that could be worthwhile

Brava123:

https://www.lymedisease.org/images/bioactive-nutraceuticalslg.jpg

Sida acuta and houttuynia are often taken for Bartonella

Dear Rainy Cloud, thank you for your answer. Yes, I ve been taking most of them but since I m already taking too much and would like to reduce, I would need to make sure I do not take unnecessarily what is not specifically for lyme. I had Bart too but thanks to God it has not been confirmed from two independent tests, so hopefully Abx has done their job at least on that one. If sida and houttu are not specifically against lyme it is better I will not be taking it. This is how i understand it. I wish health improvement and recovery to all, best wishes B