50.8 yrs old 1st PSa 12.76

Hi everyone,

This is my second post, in what is certain to be a white knuckle ride into the unknown....

I'm 50.8 yrs - 1st PSa 12.76 - DRE hard

classic PC/BPH symptoms

Since my PSa 12.76 news I've had ED (psychological vs PC/BPH nerve interference?)

My general Doc did a DRE and desribed the prostrate as very firm (apparently very firm is a euphemism for hard) because on (careful) self exam its clearly smooth and hard - I guess he wanted to avoid any freaking out (too late). He quickly referred me to the urologist - my appt is Feb 23rd. Also he ordered a second PSa and a free PSa but I've read that fPSa is not that meaningful when PSa is over 10. I did have sex (not the memorable kind) a few hours before the test - best as I can remember - I've read that ups your PSa a bit but mine so high that it's not very relevant - although I like the stats better for PSa sores under 10.

And then there the nifty stat that says younger PC paitents (me) have (tend to have?) more agressive cancer.

PSa over 10 seems to the cutoff for all the more favorable statistical outcomes. However, I've seen some posts from pretty low PSa folks that are much worse that one might think for such a low PSa number.

I guess it's all about the biopsy and G-score.

I've done a LOT of reading - this forum is probably the best. Lots of studies out there but its hard to make an assessment on a single study - lots of words like study "suggests."

TREATMENT - I've been trying to get up to speed on all the nuances but there's quite a bit of disagreement and of course I'm not a doctor.

I have an HMO and I suspect they won't stray much from standard protocol type treatment - but I won't know for a while yet.

Surgery vs EBRT for Stage 2/3 - its hard to tell what's better. Yea, I know I've got to wait for the biopsy but I'm not likely to be an early stage case based on my current info.

I want to hit this thing with an atom bomb because of my young age. I'm in good shape - I think I can take it. Bye, bye willy.... : (

Also I haven't read much about diet and exercise - I did read one study that claimed better longevity stats corellated to post treatment diet and exercise. But of course the horse is already out of the barn. If I had it to do over again (which I don't) I'd become a vegan that eats fish and no dairy.

I'm sure you can tell from the tone of my comments that I'm still adjusting - a miracle would be nice.

Any thoughts? Words of wisdom.

 

Did he have the nerve sparing procedure?

I've been married 30 years, two kids, one college grad, one in college so the spector of the loss of normal physical intimacy pales compaired to my desire for longevity.

You make a key point, having surgery after radiation is (I'm told) problematic due to scar tissue from radiation. Gleason 6 is a king of good break as things go (statistically). Did they do a post-op Gleason on the prostate?

I understand some folks that have the Da Vinci then hammer the area with RT in a total assault.

I'm considering a rigid diet and exercise change of life - although I'm pretty heathy (minus a little highly-likely nasty cancer). But I'm not sure there's much evidence it helps - but it proably won't hurt. Even if statiscally minor in its effect are worth it to me. Might help to develop firm abdominal mussle tone for incontence, erection issues, op recovery?

Also I am a person of faith, although previously somewhat dormant - you can be sure actively I'm seeking God.
I have to walk by faith because everything esle has been stripped away. This site is great for information but not too much on the touchy feely stuff.

Thanks for sharing - the best to you both.

K2, slow down a little..You haven't even seen a urologist yet..So you confirmed your GP's DRE with a self-administered one?? Wow, that's a first I think...You could post a video on facebook...Just kidding, Just kidding!

If you have not read any of the PC books, now, while you are waiting to resolve that 12.76 PSA might be a good time..The ones by Walsh and Chodak will give you a solid foundation should your worst fears come true. You can be sure we all hope you will dodge this bullet...Best of luck to you!

K2:
Before your urologist/biopsy visit , no self administered DRE, please! Refrain from sexual contact that involves ejaculation for a day or two beforehand. Discuss BPH and potential infection with the doctor. Adjust diet to a healthy heart friendly regimen if you wish. Ask about the free psa test. If biopsied, determine the size of the prostate. Join your local PCa support group. This will be GREAT for your mental health.
Now, resume breathing.

heavyz

sounds like you are trying to pull a "snake oil" treatment pitch here. i don't believe a word of any of your "examples" of sucess there. have to see if the moderator's agree with me or not.

david in sc

guys i think we need to err on the side of caution rather than calling someone out.  it's going to backfire bigtime one of these days.

ed

James C. said...
Ok, how to approach this?

David, I see nothing specific to a snake oil spam or any other thing right now. This compound is fairly common and lots of people claim benefits to it, similar to saw palmetto or OPC. I see no way that the guy is doing any spamming, unless he is a farmer who wishes to boost the basic general grains used in it. I see this no different than the other supplement recommendations we make here.

p-elliot, this poster (heavyz) is not the same one who started the thread (k2) and who did the self exam DRE, He's seperate.

TO ALL: I realize that we are sorta gun shy now from recent abuses to the Forum, but I think we need to dial back the negativity and not be so quick to accuse people in public. If you have doubts or concerns , it would be much better for you to express them in email to the Moderators, rather than publicaly calling people out. Emailing us is much better than us having to publicaly edit you to eliminate unjustified flaming of posters, especially new folks. I think we all need to take a more deliberate approach in carefully evaluating new posters and not being so quick to judge them.

AS F8 says, it's gonna backfire some day, and our rudeness and accusations can run off people who really need us and the info, support and help we can provide. As a matter of record, we have already done that a couple times, so let's err on the side of giving the benefit of doubt to people, ok?

 

Yes I got the two posters crossed my bad I'll try not to do this again.

Well, any claims made are just that. All I see is that the post surgical path report was different than the initial biopsy. How many times do we see that? I neither discount or accept that any supplement made any difference. My point is the poster , in my opinion, isn't making any claims with a profit motive, but is relating his experience as he thinks it happened, no matter how we may doubt that his supplement did it. We get lots of people and have several now, who swear that this or that or some other made all the difference in the world in their disease's course. They do have the right to think that it made a difference.

If this poster was swearing to the effectiveness of a commercial product or had some other identifiable reason to be pushing something here, I'd be the first to stop it. Sometimes we just get people who are very enthusastic and want to help the world by spreading the good news. That the rest of us may not recognize that this stuff is the good news is secondary. As it is, this supplement name is a common generic, like saw palmeto, or flour or grape seed extract, capacasin, Vit. whatever, and so many other things that are discussed here. The fact that he is a new poster is what is triggering our spam sensors. Some people just like to join conversations, especially if they think they have some good news to share. If someone who had posted 100 times had posted this, would our reaction been different? Until a rule violation occurs or something further makes me suspicious, then there's nothing I can do, without appearing rude, abrupt, and even abusive.

Fair Warning, if the changes I have made since Jan. 1 results in dramatic changes in my PSA results next week, I will be spreading the word and you'll probably want me stopped.

I don't recommend prostate surgery to anyone. It's a tough operation with a lot of after effects. So if you can avoid it, do, but that was the only 100% guarantee the docs would give me at that time.

If I knew about beta-sitosterol longer before, I might have not opted for surgery. My advice is, if you get higher than normal psa's and a wait and see recommendation from the docs, take this stuff for the period till your next psa and see what it does. If it returns to normal, it helps your prostate, if not, then keep taking as long as the wait and see advice is still advisable.

It's just what you make of it, my experiences may be different from others. It's nice to get all the information you can get to make a sound decision. The doctors also talk about all the different options one has, but never lean toward any.

My recommendation is to avoid the surgery if possible, but you don't want to end up like many men. It's too late once the cancer gets outside the prostate, i.e., to remove it before it spreads. A lot of men have slow growing cancer and beta-s is some action you can take in the interim.

K2, I am a new member here who recently under went daVinci Surgery.At 52 my first psa came back at a whopping 38. After biopsy, second psa was 49.8, with 7 out of 12 cores positive from all over. They thought it odd because my prostate was rather small& soft. It was not detected by the "Digit" test.
Everyone I talked to said the surgery was the way to go because of my young age ( I like that part) plus I have a history of cancer in my family, but not prostate. I'm the lone wolf there. Getting the cancer out was the only decision I could make, which was confirmed by my wife.
My post op visit was a good news bad news deal. All lymph nodes negative, but the cancer was not contained, but in the margin and all infected tissue removed. The next PSA in March will tell if I will need radiation or not.
So far the most aggravating part of the surgery has been the incontinence. As far as your sex life don't sweat that part.I'm sure your better half would rather have you around than not. And beside you get some new toys to play with(VED)!
Good luck on your next visit and keep us informed on the results! Just remember to relax a little,you'll give yourself an ulcer!

K2
PSA is always elevated after biopsy for several weeks (6 - 8) DaSlink said the psa was after biopsy. Thus it would spike dramatically upward.

K2

My advice to you would be to go slow, stay calm, and get expert advice. There is a ton of stuff on the Internet about prostate cancer and not all of it is accurate.

Different people have different outcomes. People are also wired differently.

I had robotic surgery at age 63 and am glad that I did. I have friend who was made a few changes in his lifestyle and "watched" for 8 years and he is doing fine. I would be a mental wreck.

If you do have surgery, my other advice would be to do some research and find the best surgeon that makes sense for you to use. Three years ago I went an extra hour to a better known more experienced surgeon rather than the local guy who was younger and did not have much of a track record. Three years later and the local guy has done many many surgeries and is highly regarded, so today I would probably see him. I know of a wealthy Texan who went to NYC. It did not make sense to me to leave Southern California.

Good luck.