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Posted 6/25/2011 9:29 PM (GMT 0)
seems like  to me when you get diagnosed with rising psa,  even before you

get a definitive prostate cancer diagnosis, the train leaves the station

and you get on that psa, biopsy train you cant get off,

and i know alot of people have been saved by a psa exam testing

but i just wonder how many doctors scream biopsy, to protect themselves

from lawsuits for not recommending it,

to be honest with u, i dont know what i am trying to say here,

but ever since 4/28/2011 when i found out my psa jumped,

i havent been able to sleep with out taking pills,

i am scared to get biopsy because of side effects, and literature i read about needle could spread cancer cells into blood stream, seems like your darned if u do, and darned if u dont, already have one bad disease crohns

just dont know if i could cope with some thing else.

thanx for listening tigerpawn,

now brought down to a kitten

Posted 6/25/2011 9:42 PM (GMT 0)
Tigerpawn,

A lot of us have been in the same boat. I didn't sleep more than 2-3 hours any night from the day my "bad" psa came back to the night after my DaVinci.

I'm sure I've chimed in on the "biopsy/ cancer spread" discussion before, but it is the tool we have. There are so many other things out there that are just as / more dangerous that we do every day, that it just can't worry me. My post-op path was so much worse than what the biopsy showed that it becomes a trade-off - is what you don't know more of a risk than what you do know?

Hang in there -

Posted 6/25/2011 9:50 PM (GMT 0)
Seems to me that if you have cancer that is so virulent , that a biopsy could cause it to spread, then you want it out immediately
So with that logic, either you do RP based on PSA only, or you do a biopsy
Clearly nobody recommends a PSA only diagnostic, so you are left with biopsy or imaging.
I don't think any study has or can show spread of PCa by biopsy
It's more of a theoretical possibility/myth

Get the biopsy and know for sure what the situation is
Posted 6/25/2011 9:51 PM (GMT 0)
Tigerpawn, there is very little evidence that a biopsy causes PCa to spread to the blood. I saw the % somewhere but cant put my finger on it. The other side effects are very slight. The biopsy can be uncomfortable but in most cases thats about it. Dread not the biopsy but waiting for the results is the kicker. Get er done and be over with it. Then you can move on.


Cajun jeff
Posted 6/25/2011 9:56 PM (GMT 0)
Thanx, for your input, sometimes what we do know can kill us more than
We want to know, example, a couple I know her husband went in for a simple
Back operation, other than bad back, perfectly healthy,
He got through with operation, he is discharged from hospital but
Had not left yet, wife went downstairs to get car to pick him up
She goes in hospital
To get him, he fell over dead in wheel chair,
Any way thanx
For helping
Tigerpawn
Posted 6/25/2011 10:14 PM (GMT 0)
The catch 22. Yes if biopsy comes back negative, your happy
But how happy can u be, biopsy is random u could still have it
They just didn't hit it, case in point know a gentleman with high psa
Very high, had standard biopsy and I believe 2 saturation biopsies
All negative, dr told him he had prostate cancer they just hadn't hit it
Yet,
That's comforting
Tigerpawn
Posted 6/25/2011 11:54 PM (GMT 0)
Tough love here. How happy can you be with canc spreading and you do,t know or ignore it? Worry over a biopsy just don,t compare to an unconfirmed, untreated case of prostate cancer spreading inside you. Not knowing because of fear of a biopsy or some mbillion to one odds of needle transfer just doesn,t make sense. Truth is, there is no other method to detect cancer. Yes, it might miss small ones, but when it comes down to it, there,s just no other reliable, proven method of determing presence of canc and being able to know to what extent it is in the gland. If it were me, I would be much more afraid of the unseen menace than a known method that is proven safe and effective in most cases to detect cancer. If I were so fearful that it was interfering with my ability to make decisions that affect the quality and length of my life, then some type of counseling would be where I would be heading now. Sorry to be so harsh, but that,s my thoughts on the subject. Good luck in your very important decisions you must now make. It is a decision that must be made, for good or ill.
Posted 6/26/2011 12:07 AM (GMT 0)
Tiger,

The chances of cancer spreading by a biopsy is almost non-existitant. The side effects from a biopsy for most men, is minimal and short lasting. It's the best tool we have right now for detecting PC. You may worry left, if you get this done, and put this part behind you. Fear of the unknown is often the worse part.

Good luck to you, and right now, your own future is in your own hands,

David in Sc
Posted 6/26/2011 12:14 AM (GMT 0)
James c, I luv the smokey mountains are u near there in east tn
Tigerpawn
Posted 6/26/2011 12:14 AM (GMT 0)
Purgatory said a mouthful IMO as fear of the unknown is a tough deal. It's just a human reaction that all of us deal with.
Posted 6/26/2011 12:16 AM (GMT 0)
Does the Doppler color ultrasound not do just as good
As needle biopsy.
Tigerpawn
Posted 6/26/2011 12:34 PM (GMT 0)
Tigerpawn, I'm in Kingsport, Upper E. Tn. No the color doppler is not an effective or accurate as a needle biopsy. It has it's uses, but isn't ready for prime time in being the optimum method of choice in determining prostate cancer cells in the prostate. It will show mass and even size, but still can't tell what that mass is. I'm afraid that needle biopsy is the definitive, most accurate way of doing it. Physcially removing and examining tissue under a microscope by a trained pathologist yields the best and most accurate information as to the condition of the gland and any possible presence of cancer.

Post Edited (James C.) : 6/26/2011 6:53:40 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 6/27/2011 2:14 PM (GMT 0)
Here is a distraction for you, and there are many of us here

on the PSA/Biopsy train, all you got to do is hop on board.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ervf7hIxZ3Y

Posted 6/27/2011 3:20 PM (GMT 0)
The side effects of a prostate biopsy are minimal. I had my first biopsy in 2000 due to urgency issues. My PSA at the time was 3.2. I was 54. The biopsy was negative and a month later the symptoms disappeared. My PSA continued to climb, however: five year later, when it jumped from 4.8 to 5.6 over 12 months, my urologist ordered a second biopsy. I was having no symptoms, and the digital rectal exam was normal. I did have an enlarged prostate. The biopsy showed 3 of 12 tissue samples as being malignant. The biopsies were pain free - like getting a slight pinch. I had surgery in March of 2006. My latest PSA level was undetectable. So the biopsy helped save my life. My father and two younger brothers have each been diagnosed with prostate cancer and are doing well. They had no issues with their biopsies .... I work as a hospice social worker, and have had about a dozen prostate patients with terminal cancer. In the majority of those cases, individuals ignored warning signs and were not tested ... Now, I'm not telling you what to do. Individual choice is what it's all about. Just wanted to share my experience.
Posted 6/27/2011 7:09 PM (GMT 0)
thanx, i guess barring a miracle biopsy here i come, remember that song by johnny cash, "how highs the water momma 2 feet and rising,
i guess i will be asking doc, how highs the psa..
tigerpawn, now reduced to a *****cat
tigerpawn
Posted 6/28/2011 1:25 AM (GMT 0)
At this point you should ask yourself, why even get your psa tested. You did that and it indicated that futher tests are needed. Biopsy. What are your options? if you don't follow this through you just as well to not go back the the uro for more psa's, what would be the point? This sounds blunt? well this is a blunt situation you are in. Your uro is probably not asking for a biopsy to cover his rear end, he is doing what he is trained to do and what you went to him for in the first place. I hope that you see this through.
Ron
Posted 6/28/2011 5:07 PM (GMT 0)
All this is shy I'm glad the time lag between meeting the uro and the biopsy was 10-15 minutes. It was over before I could gen up any worry.
Posted 6/28/2011 5:15 PM (GMT 0)
I had 4 biopsies over a 10 year period starting in 1998. The last one in 2008 tested positive for PC. But over the years, my urologist was convinced that I had cancer but that the biopsy needles just missed it. I guess that what I am saying is that even if the biopsy is negative, you are not necessarily out of the woods. You just have to keep doing them according to the urologists recommenation based on PSA.  Anyway they are no big deal and everything is healed in a few days.
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