HealingWell
Search Close Search
☰

Incontinence questions.

Support Forums
>
Prostate Cancer
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply
❬ ❬ Previous Thread |Next Thread ❭ ❭
Posted 7/3/2011 5:37 PM (GMT 0)
I'm 58 years old and only 3 weeks post op and I know I am being premature with my concerns about my incontinence but I am wondering if anyone else out there has had the same symptoms or situation as me. My situation is as follows I'm completely dry at night although I have to get up several times to go to the bathroom, I am almost completely dry if I'm just sitting but when I go for a walk I'm totally incontinent. I will empty my bladder before I start the walk but as soon as my kidneys send any urine to my bladder it goes straight through the urethra to my pad. I have no warning or sensation until it's coming out into the pad. I am working on my Kegals regularly and hope this resolves it at some point. My questions are:

Has anyone else experienced the same circumstances?

Did your incontinence eventually clear up?

If so, how long did it take and did it clear up in stages like you able to walk for 5 mins. dry, then later 10 mins. dry, etc. or did you just find one day you seemed to have control again?

Thanks for any input you can give me. I find the incontinence the most humbling and humiliating thing I've experienced and at this point I'm much more concerned with it than ED.
Posted 7/3/2011 5:58 PM (GMT 0)
RC,

I am in the EXACT same position you are in. I had my RALP surgery on June 9th and my catheter taken out a week later on June 17th.

From the get-go, I've been largely completely dry at night. During the day, it's a different story. If I am inactive (sitting at the computer, watching TV, etc.), I can hold my water just fine until I can get to the bathroom. However, if I am active at all (walking, exercising, washing the car, etc.), then the faucet opens. Like you, I have no sensation of it happening; I just know that I will need to change my pad in short order.

At night, I wear one of the larger, high-capacity Depends-brand pads. But during the day, the larger pads are too uncomfortable and I've been wearing ladies panty liners. I go through 3 to 4 of those liners a day, depending on my activity.

I know it's only been just over three weeks since the surgery, but it seems to me things are improving a bit, albeit slowly. As I've been changing my pads, it just seems they have less weight to them suggesting I'm not leaking as much.

But I am completely on board with you; it is a humbling and humiliating issue to deal with. Sex is the last thing on my mind; I want this incontinence issue resolved first.
Posted 7/3/2011 6:02 PM (GMT 0)
Hello ranger,
I can identify with your situation. I was 58 at the time of surgery. It took me some 5 months to gain continence. That was in 1992. I am still continent and I still do Kegels. We are all somewhat different. Some men gain continence right away. For others it takes a little longer. This is the routine I use then and now. Hope it works for you:

Kegel Exercise Routine
The key to doing Kegels right is to properly identify the pelvic muscles that will help improve your continence. How to do that?
1. First, you need to be able to stop or at least slow down urinary flow while urinating
2. Sit or stand at the toilet and interrupt flow, stopping and starting the stream a few times
3. Avoid squeezing your anal muscles. Identify the muscles that stop and start flow
4. With an empty bladder start contracting and holding the contraction of the identified muscles for about three to five seconds. Then relax the muscles for a second or two.
5. Once you are confident of exercising the correct muscles, start an exercise program that will increase the strength of those muscles. Avoid over exercising. This can hurt your progress.
6. Start with a set of 5 long contractions (3 to 5 seconds) and 5 short contractions (one second). Do this twice a day to start
7. Build your “stamina” by increasing the number of cycles slowly. Again do not hurt the muscles by overdoing too much. Get to do 10 long contractions and 10 short contractions three times a day without getting tired.
8. Once you master the routine. Alternate short and long contractions.
9. Be patient. It takes time to regain continence.

Again, overdoing them can delay progress. Be persistent!

RalphV
Posted 7/3/2011 6:10 PM (GMT 0)
I feel your pain. It's the most humbling and humiliating -- and I'll add frustrating -- thing I've ever experienced too.

I think what you're going through is very common three weeks out from surgery. Try to be patient, and try to manage it as best you can. Kegels are good, but don't overdo them out of frustration. Too many can be worse than too few.

As for how long you'll be able to walk, it isn't as if you'll be fully dry the first five or 10 or 15 minutes of your walk. You'll drip constantly, but as you heal you'll drip less. Over time it becomes less of an issue.

For now, it'll just be a management issue. Empty your bladder as soon as you get up, before walking anywhere. And put on a fresh pad before taking a walk. Being stingy with pads doesn't make you any more continent; it just makes you more prone to a rash you definitely won't enjoy having.

I don't have exact statistics, but something like two-thirds of men are significantly improved within three months. According to my doc's statistics, 98 percent are dry within a year. Of course, statistics are just that. You may beat the odds or they may beat you.

Good luck with your healing. Try to keep some perspective about this; you're very early in the healing process. Chances are you'll be much better in another month or two.
Posted 7/3/2011 6:58 PM (GMT 0)
RC,

The comment was made about the statistics beating you - that is my part, am bruised and sore from it.

At just about 21 months from DaVinci surgery, I am still on at least one pad per day, sometimes more, and my adjuvant radiation probably made that permanent.

I was, first day off the catheter, dry at night, and I did not have to get up during the night. BUT, I did keep a bucket by the bed, since the first couple of mornings I could not make it to the toilet. Once I sat up, it was seconds to flood, not minutes. Over time, I have had major floods at night, almost always associated to something carbonated (beer, coke, sparkling water, doesn't matter, just carbonated), so I still keep a pad at night. But now I can actually walk, not run, to the toilet. I do have to be sure the "facility" is available before I sit up, as once up, the clock is ticking.

Daytime was another story altogether. For 3 months I wore a depends pant, and went through a very slow improvement from 7-8 pads in a day down to 2-3, with some real ugly days (the pant was a must for any real activity). Over time, with several short walks per day instead of one long one, and a kegels session at the end of each, I started making more progress than I had with the one long (1-2 mile walk). I suspect that it was "less is better" when done more othen.

By 5 months the pants were gone, and I was at just 1 pad a day. Then came RT - now I'm back at 1 most days, 2 a few, and the rare 3. The nighttime flood is still guaranteed if I have a beer after 7pm, or more than one cup of coffee in a day. So many adjustments had to be made, but there has been progress. Too slow for my liking, but it is better than it was.

Posted 7/3/2011 8:55 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks for the responses and advice, it's much appreciated. If nothing else it sure helps knowing there are guys out there feeling and dealing with the same issues I am. I wish you all the best.
Posted 7/3/2011 9:43 PM (GMT 0)
RC,
I had the same issues happen to me after surgery. It took me 3 to 4 months before I stopped using a pad. Even now, after almost 2.5 years I use a liner when I'm doing a lot of physical activity as protection in case few drops leek out.
Posted 7/3/2011 10:22 PM (GMT 0)
Hi--H-D Ryder and I had surgey on the same day and the Foley came out 1 week later and I have the same thing--dry all night but leak all day BUT I do note I am able to sense the leak better and wind up doing an almost constant Kegal until I'm distracted and relax and its starts leaking again
As for knowing when I have to urinate,that's fine and steam and bldder capacity are good also.
When I chnage position that has anything to do with tensing my abdominal muscles,if I don't Keagle,I'll leak--and when you think of it,it makes sense

All of this is a work in progress
Posted 7/3/2011 10:54 PM (GMT 0)
Sounds pretty normal progress but the kegals will help. The bladder wall is a muscle, it is used to being relaxed so it can hold volumes of urine under pressure. After the trauma of surgery the muscle contracts and wants to stay that way. Magnesium is a muscle relaxer and can help with bladder control. Also stay away from caffiene as much as possible.
Posted 7/4/2011 1:53 AM (GMT 0)
RC, there is another discussion about 8 threads down about Whining started by Jazz.  Almost the same topic.  Almost the same people contributing.  From the wives' point of view and the research I have done, your situation is very typical.  Please try to not get discouraged!

I'll post what I wrote and hope this isn't against the rules, but I encourage you to read that thread also!

My husband was on two pads a day for several months after his August surgery.  He was sent to physical therapy for 8 weeks and it definitely helped.  He was taught the proper way to do the Kegels and later the pelvic floor exercises.  He still does them faithfully.

Recently though, he has started to leak when walking more than 10 minutes and when lifting heavy items.  He uses a ladies mini-pad on his walks.  He found this an

inconvenience, so his doctor prescripted some medication.

First was neurontin (gabapentin) 300 mg once a day, then progressing to two a day, with three a day after 4 weeks for NERVOUSNESS.   Ron never made it past the two a day as these pills made him feel like a zombie.  He has stopped them.

The other pill is for DEPRESSION but is used for incontinence problems.  You can research this medication.  It is amitriptyline HCL 10 mg taken at night.

He still has probelms but not as severe.   I think the physical rehab may help reduce the problem.  It certainly is worth checking into.  I wish you the best in solving this problem!

Aimzee

Posted 7/4/2011 6:40 AM (GMT 0)
At three weeks I had a plastic garbage bag on the seat of my car (only needed it once) just in case.

Progress will happen -- but at different speeds for different people. The hardest thing to get used to was talking to the young grocery store checkout-clerk while I knew I was pxxing in my pants.
Posted 7/4/2011 1:01 PM (GMT 0)
I wasn't able to make a pee stream for at least 6 days after my catheter was taken out. On that day we did the Happy Dance. A reason to celebrate but truly not a smart move. That led to my first pad break through. At about the 2 month stage I was comfortable enough to drop the pad at night. Shortly after, I got the courage to leave the pad off during the day while at home. Wear a swim suit during those days.
Now at 5 months post op, I am basically pad free. I wear one to work for some tiny stress incontinence since I do a lot of heavy lifting and bending over. Those types usually occur in the morning. Remember that caffene and spicy food are a bladder irritant and don't help the situation at all.
Kegal-Kegal- Kegal is the word of the day,and there are brighter days coming!!!
Posted 7/4/2011 4:18 PM (GMT 0)
My husband had a robotic prostatectomy almost 6 months ago. He is down to about 1 pad a day now. When he does work around the house when he bends and squats he has some leakage. He is doing pretty good but sometimes on occasion he does have some leakage. His doctor told him it takes about 6 months for things to improve. My husband said he is sick of wearing a pad. We are hoping down the road he can stop wearing the pad. I would say just hang in there and slowly things will improve.
Posted 7/4/2011 4:38 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks again for all the responses, I appreciate the advice, guidance and support.
Posted 7/4/2011 10:42 PM (GMT 0)
Hello RC

It will get better, frustrating as it is, I am 4mths out and 99.9% dry, for last month, .1 is not shaking enough wink

at three weeks I was the same as you, dry at night and leak by day, it's a horrible feeling, but it did improve, I did kegels but not as often as recomended. I haven't done any for ages. I have had a few wet nights when red wine was involved, but not everytime and not for last month so maybe that has past as well.

I now know when I gotta go, in the first weeks, I would just go to the loo regularly and drip or pee didn't know what was going to happen, now I have full sensation back and can hold on much longer, so hang in there, if your dry at night thats a promising start 

My doc said he puts two stitches in the pelvic floor somewhere? can't remember, and has had great response with his patients incontinence.  

Posted 7/5/2011 12:51 PM (GMT 0)
Cupcake, I have purchased some women's (menstrual) pads for my husband and they work well for small leakage when he goes for long walks.  They work well and are cheaper.  It's our secret!

Aimzee

Posted 7/6/2011 3:01 AM (GMT 0)
rc - wishing you the best on your recovery - the best news I read while I was recovering - and being impatient about returning to "normal" (as we all are) - was that it does take time for the muscles and nerves endings to repair and start communicating with each other ... and it can take 14-16 weeks before you can attempt to have some bladder control - on week 14 I was checking out the condom-style catheters for use while driving - I would gush whenever I stood up from the car - but on week 16, I was able to stand up without wetting myself.
-am down to one pad a day - mostly from stress incontinence from work ( in a garden centre) - but dry at night.
-wishing you all the best,
hugs,
Bronson
Posted 7/6/2011 2:40 PM (GMT 0)
Hello!
I had SURGERY 5/31/11!davinci.I am going thru the same thing,except more complications,I think you are doing very well,what I can tell you, is take it easy,I am in extreme pain I think a hernia,but I'm not sure,I goto the PA tomorrow to see why the pain when I walk,It just came on after doing minor yard work!The leaking does slow at night but as everyone said getting up from a chair or bed is a wet expirence,we can only hope and do what they tell us.Good luck to you.
PSA:5.2
3+3=6 GLEASON
3 OF 12 SAMPLES POS,4TH sample unknown???
Davinci 5/31 prosectomy.
Posted 7/6/2011 5:02 PM (GMT 0)
I had DaVinci October, 2009  - it took me 18 months before I felt I was in control of incontinence - and even that is considered totally within the normal recovery time.  If you're dry at night right off, there is little to indicate the daytime experience will not follow - just may take longer than you want.  You've heard it here:  "the new normal"
Posted 7/30/2011 6:12 PM (GMT 0)
RCCRANGER

I just read your post from earlier this month and wanted to see how the leaking problems have progressed. I had my RALP on June 8th the day before yours. I had to use one pad per day from June 15th when my catheter was removed until July 1 when I found I could stay dry all day and have not used a pad since. I was able to stay dry at night from the beginning. I did and continue to do 20 sets of Kegels per day per my URO's advice. The only time I have any leaks is when I need to pass gas as I will drip a drop or two.  I now try to use a toilet when is is time to pass the gas, which pleases my wife.

 

Posted 7/31/2011 1:05 AM (GMT 0)
RCCRANGER

I had my surgery on 20 July. I am dry at night, but like you I am leaking  a bit during the day (4 days post catheter). Up to now it's the usual activities that start the leak: getting up from a chair, sneezing etc. and like Water Guy "farting" brings it on, so I will have to stop that (another of life's little pleasures to be foresaken)!!

I am trying not to take things too seriously in the hope that eventually I will improve.

Do any of you guys still need to get up frequently at night for a leak? Currently I am needing to get up 3 times a night, which is worse than before I had my Prostate removed. Can I expect some improvement here?

 

Posted 7/31/2011 1:31 AM (GMT 0)
Ozbob,

I have been dry at night almost since the catheter was removed. The number of times I have to get up to pee at night depends on how much I drink before bed. I do not have any liquids after 9 pm and have gotten my night pees down to once or twice which is what it was pre surgery

Posted 10/20/2012 9:42 PM (GMT 0)
Hi all... I know this is a relatively old thread.... But I would like to hear how some of the original posters are doing now! I had surgery on 10-2 -2012 and catheter romoved on 10-9. I have all the same issues, dry at night, mostly when sitting, but no control at all when walking. Come back from 2-3 mile walk with soaked pad...have no urge to go while walking..just seems to dribble out....let me know how you guys made out 3 to 4 months... later..thx
Posted 10/20/2012 10:08 PM (GMT 0)
My experience was exactly like the original poster. At four months after DaVinci RP I finally seem to be making some progress. I have a theory about why that is. I just started a separate thread about it.
Posted 10/20/2012 10:30 PM (GMT 0)
What is title of the link
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply