Who are we - What are we doing -Why are we doing it

No one has advocated making HW PC a pity club. That is an extreme comparison.

Extremes in life never seem to be the right approach, finding the proper balance is more difficult to obtain ,because of the variety of people here, their personalities, their levels of interests, etc.

But it is sad, when even long term members can't/don't/won't take the time to acknowledge a newcomer, let alone take the time to answer what is often a simple question. Nothing to do with being judgmental, nothing to do with being, as someone put it, "official greeter". It's more about common courtesy in a support site in my opinion.

All of us were once strangers here, like being the new kid in school and feeling awkward about introducing oneself to the classroom. I feel its essential to make everyone feel at ease and welcome. So what is wrong with that approach?

As far as bumping, due to the sheer volume of threads at times, let alone the responses to the threads, a good thread doesn't just die a "natural death", it can get lost in the shuffle. I see nothing wrong with anyone bumping a thread that may have gotten missed in the crowd, or perhaps never even answered at all. That is commonly done in every forum I have ever visited.

If all of us (myself included) would learn to skip over threads that either irk us, or have no interest in, or no experience in, I would think that would cut down immensely some of the more troublesome moments.

I have started doing this myself, example, the recent POM thread. In the past, I would want to represent the anti-POM school, but feel its no longer would serve any purpose. If someone wants to be on POM, vitamins or any other supplement - unless its something obviously harmful to the person, then there's no point in opposing it for the sake of opposing.

Also, there are just certain subjects that just might not pertain knowledge or experience wise to a reader, example, unless someone is looking for direct encouragement, I stay out of most all the ED and/or Incontinence threads. Neither were issues for me, so I don't have first hand experience for dealing with those subjects.

And of course, there will always be a certain amount of contentious by nature threads, the very subject matter will stir up strong feelings in either direction. Those are the ones that its either best to skip over, or learn (myself included) to agree politely to disagree before it turns into WW3.

We do have among the heaviest traffic at all of the HW forums, so more threads and more posts can lead to more issues. I hate to think of our view count as just being a money maker, I had never heard of that before a post was made above about that perspective.

I know at some of the other communities here at HW, in a days time, you might be lucky to pick up a half a dozen posts. The volume here is amazing at times.

And no, I am not lecturing.  Just talking out loud, just thinking that if each of us (myself included) just tried a little bit harder on our own ends, things would probably balance out to where it should be.

I am totally against any form of censorship or making certain subjects taboo, except the obvious ones of religion and politics which are already banned by the rules of the forum.

david in sc

Post Edited (Purgatory) : 6/4/2013 12:37:45 PM (GMT-6)

So Peter, and that post was very well worded, then perhaps the real answer is somewhere between the two views of "personallizers" and "dissociators" as you described them. In line with what I was saying above, I feel that extremes at the ends of any subject, can often be out of balance in reality. Plus none of us can please everyone all of the time, that shouldn't even be the goal of posting. You believe what you believe, as I do, and as others do, so it shouldn't be always seen as "all right" or "all wrong".

david

Very interesting the path this thread has taken, with some very heavy hitters weighing in on what they think.

I thought about throwing more of my own opinion and thoughts in on this but then thought better of it.

Instead I simply decided to go back and read Sonny's original post in this thread as IMHO he's done an excellent job of trying to bring all factions back together harmoniously and yet still provide everything from both extremes of the important "clinical" stuff in our PCa world as well as the "Hello John Doe..." and from my perspective BOTH have a place here.

I would sincerely ask that everyone go back and read Sonny's original post as I honestly believe he has captured the essence of what all are striving to have......

Peace..........

I agree yooper.....some of this talk is getting deep for my simple minded head...LOL....I thought sonny nailed it.

Yoop, I agree with much of Sonny's original post and, as always with Sonny, it was beautifully written.  However, integrated into the pretty words was an underlying message of intolerance and censorship.  Sonny says, "So why in the hell do we keep beating the horse to death about ODOT, Screening, Biopsies, ad-nausea and so on here at HW."  "So why must we continually debate these topics to the extreme". "The wording may be different but the message remains the same."   So, what Sonny wants is to stop talking about these topics and get back to what he sees as the real business of HW which he expresses as, "I come here to see if there is someone that can benefit from my experiences or take some comfort in what I have to offer.  I come here to try and help folks understand that the goal is Living Life to Its Absolute Fullest while traveling this journey. To give this crap its due diligence when it is required and then go back to living life."  That's great and I applaud Sonny for his reasons for being here and for all the support he provides on this site.  However, not everyone has the same perspective and I think it's dangerous when we attempt to shut people up or shut off the conversation because it doesn't fit into our own perspective of what should be done.   Let me take you back several years at HW...and David/Purg can attest to this.  When I joined there was one other active brachytherapy patient (actually wife), JustJulie.  Over the course of my years here I posted many, many times about the positive aspects of brachytherapy.   I posted in response to new patients seeking advice, in response to mis-characterizations of brachy and as new threads intended to share the research on the protocol.   I am certain there were some who thought I was “beating a dead horse” or “delivering the same message” or going on “ad-nausua”.   These days I rarely have to do that.   We have numerous brachy patients who can extol its virtues and most of the surgery patients also recognize that this is a legitimate alternative. Perhaps the AUA is wrong; perhaps Tony is wrong.   However, maybe they are right.   Shouldn’t we allow all the debate necessary to sort this out?   So, rather than suggesting we censor or relocate these valuable (to some) discussions, my position is that we let them continue (maybe flourish).   Those that disagree can do so and state their cases.   Or they can ignore the discussion.   What’s so wrong with that? Jim

Tud/Jim

I will vouch for what you said. You arrived at HW one month before me, and you were one of the first to greet me, and considered you a friend from day one.

Yes, in the "old" days, late 2008 - you were the lone ranger about Seeds, and many surgery guys tried hard to discredit your treatment choice. If you remember, even though I had surgery, I was one of your earliest supporters, and over the years, have constantly brought up the seed option to many a new comer to our ranks. I wanted seeds myself, but at that time in my area, it was ruled out.

I no longer see those kinds of arguments - about primary treatment choices, people seem more open and receptive. That is a good change in the evolution of HW.

David in sC

absolutely not, John. I didn't start this thread or any other thread pertaining to this particular controversy. I merely stated my opinion after reading several posts on the topic. I have a very big issue with one sided advocacy/propaganda and will continue to speak out against it in as respectful a manner a sis possible.

and ps, Tony himself suggested a new section. He called it "advanced PCa" but I prefer Peter's "Advocacy in PCa" That suggestion isn't beating anything to death, I think it's a good idea.

Post Edited (davidg) : 6/4/2013 4:31:14 PM (GMT-6)

Yoop, we are on the same page!  I espcially agree with your last paragraph.  Your "Disgusted..." thread was right on the money.  The threads that precipitated that were clearly filled with immature blatant attacks on individuals.  Very sad...

What is even sadder to me is that evidently, this attack mode has now caused one of the most knowledgeable posters on our forum and one of the finest men to decide to leave.  I'm still hoping Tony will change his mind..

Jim

No one is forcing anyone to leave HW, that should be made clear. Others have threatened to in the past, some have gone through with it, others change their minds, while still others leave then come back ( I have been in that class myself).

In the past, when someone has threatened to leave, the crowd usually says, if that's the way you feel, then leave and don't make it public, and don't let the door slam on you on the way out.

Just seems like different rules for different people.

Each person here choose to stay or go of their own accord. No one is forced out. And I don't see any reason for anyone to leave because of certain events that have transpired the past couple of months, unless this is what they feel right for themselves.

david

What is absolutely fascinating to me, is to watch people describe themselves perfectly to a tee, yet reference the description to "other" people.

If I ever do that, someone please thump me on the head. ;)

And that's all I have to say about that.

Purgatory it really is the way things are expressed, more than t the content, that creates the negative dynamics. I think it is nice that people express their loss if someone decides to go. Now thats a positive change to the " old days " I was comforted the times i got fed up, Im sure others who "left" were also. " don't let the door slam you in the back" is a place I don't want to return to. I agree nobody forces anyone out, thats absurd. For the record , I think Tony is leaving/left , simply because he wants to. It takes a big ego to think they are the cause for someone else's action.He may have done a Ben Franklin balance sheet, he may have flipped a coin. It is the forums loss, imo, but again someone else's or groups gain, so in the big picture all is well in the balance of yin/yang. Why do we have to assess fault,reason, blame. All pay close attn to next sentence or two. Also when anyone is responding to a post, this one for instant , not thread, post, yours for instance purgatory.. Not every word, sentence, phrase, nuance, is directed at the post 's author, som e are just thoughts that flow, one to another, for the original poster, for the forum in general, and sometime to the universe, they just want to express. When I respond to a post I write to all who reads it. Sephie said it well, thin skin, not necessarily you. We all are human and have weaknesses , but as humans we all have free will and the ability, indeed the responsibility, to use that will to overcome our weaknesses. why cant we all agree to exercise our will in this manner. Just like a bicep, the will gets stronger with exercise. Off to Mcdonalds with me love for some balance to the yin/yang. Logo

logo - once again, I have no idea what you just posted, lol, where's that translator of mine. If you were trying to make a point to me, I didn't get it.

david in sc

Andrew: I thought we already agreed that broccoli was to be banned from the planet, so sure wouldn't want to discuss it, unless its about plans to eradicate it.


david in sc