What is normal T level

You've wandered into a wobbly bit in the science here, K. There is a sort of a mainstream, sensible consensus position -- that one should worry slightly about T levels but not actually do anything about them one way or another -- not so much because rising T levels aren't seen as a concern but because, as long as the T levels are achieved naturally, patients are unlikely to sue their doctors if thir cancer recurs because the doctors, after all, didn't actually do anything.

There's also a controversial position that once T levels get much above castrate levels it simply doesn't matter how high that level goes. An analogy I like is that once the water is over your head it doesn't matter, from a drowning perspective, how deep it is; you can drown just as well in 20 feet of water as in 20,000 feet. As for prostate cancer, it says that your cancer is exactly as likely to recur at a T level of 1200 as at 200.

The first position (that T is bad but what can you do?) has common sense on it's side. The wild-assed "T doesn't matter" theory appears to have most of the science (what little there is).

Here are a few links (both feature the same doctor, the lead wildman):

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23234627

www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvnUGAmnD1c

K,
I have some questions: Why would you start HT after RP when your PSA was so low? (0.04)
And why would you discontinue the HT? Why would you have an implant so early, just 5 mos after surgery?
Like you, I am curious to understand the impact of an increased T level on PSA. I believe Testosterone hormone would feed any cancer prostate cells and thus the PSA would increase but would it be immediate or would it take some months, that I don't know.

Thanks so much guys. Great information that I knew would arrive.

Peter, thanks for the input. I have also heard about some guys getting T injections for PCa. PCa is one confusing disease.

Allen, 6 weeks after biopsy, I had the radical prostatectomy. A few months later I started a two year regimen of HT. No radiation.

Traveller, starting HT right after surg was a difficult decision. My uro strongly recommended the 2 year regimen. At the time, general thinking was to wait until psa started to rise before starting HT. I believe my Uro was ahead of general thinking. I have since read many articles addressing an organ contained, low psa, but high Gleason PCa and beginning HT for a minimum of 18 months. My uro explained this in terms of cell life in the human body. He had some really good logic, and eventually convinced me to start it.
It was a 2 year regimen from the beginning. Now, we are monitoring psa and T levels on a quarterly basis. This was controversial at the time, but less so now. My urological oncologist, Dr Oliver Sartor at Tulane U., in New Orleans was vehemently against it, but has since acknowledged the potential benefit.
Implant....wow, what a topic of discussion this has been. I've talked about my willy more in the last two years, than the prior 10.....lol. My uro sat down with me and discussed this at length after several difficult and disappointing experiences with pumps, caverject, and trimix. He recommended the implant as I had lost both nerves, and nothing else worked well. The timing was partially a financial one. Due to all of the treatments and surgeries, I was well into 100% coverage, so the implant was done at no cost. Since I had retired and with all the obamacare uncertainty along with possibility of big changes in my own insurance along with a high deductible, I proceeded to have it done. Had I waited, the cost would have been more difficult to manage. Okay, that's the long version. The short version is that I'm a cheapskate, and as my uro said, "you're going to have to have it anyway, and this way it will be easier to pump it up occasionally while your on ht.....just for rehab purposes."

I hope that all made sense.

K

Hi K,
Thanks for the information, now I understand. I am happy for you that the ed issue is fixed. One more question: how did you dr. explain the stable PSA at 0.04 before and after the HT. May be the lowest detectable level of the test is 0.04. Could the test results be >0.04? Mine was 0.03 before HT and dropped to 0.003 after the HT.

Actually Traveller, since the surgery, my psa has been nondetect. 0.04 is the lowest possible measurement of the lab machine my doc has. I'm blessed in that from the time my blood is drawn, it's less than 30 minutes that my doc sticks his head in and gives me the thumbs up.....non detect. If he ever takes much longer than 30 minutes, I'll probably be out in the hallway hunting him....he he

K