A Diet For Prostate Cancer

I'm updating the Diet and Exercise thread.

My current baseline diet is giving me ZERO PSA growth.

NOTE: MY last update had me removing all fruit. The result was outstanding
for the first reading after removal. However, the next three test periods
showed a consistent and continuous decline in performance, down to
14 months PSADT. Added three raspberries back to the oatmeal, and the
PSADT went to 102 months, consistent with numbers I was getting prior to the
zero fruit experiment. YES, you guessed it, I'm now trying 4-5 raspberries.

First some background. After surgery and radiation (SRT) have failed to stop
a rising PSA, I decided to get serious about diet and exercise. Now I have over
5 years of data using the Labcorp Ultrasensitive test and careful notes on my
diet. With a Gleason score of 6, and a PSA doubling time (PSADT) of about 7
months, post surgery AND post radiation, I am trying to control cancer
growth through diet and exericise.

My working hypothesis is that cancer cells need "insulin" and "iron" to grow.
Receptors for such are overexpressed on cancer cells compared to normal cells.
With that in mind, this is what I'm doing:

1) Make sure supplements do not contain "sugar", "Iron" nor "Chondroitin Sulfate".

2) Minimize an insulin response. The less sugar and fast carbs, the better the results.

3) No red meat, no eggs, and no dairy.

4) Basic diet is (organic) vegan with seafood. But, no farmed raised fish.

5) I start lunch and dinner with a plate of raw vegetables, especially broccoli
and broccoli sprouts. I have it with hummus made with olive oil, and add
turmeric spice, ground black pepper, rosemary, and oregano to the hummus.

6) Use Olive oil when you need oil.

7) Brown over white for carbs, if you have to.

8) Have some soy product daily . . . soy beans, tofu or bean curd.

9) I have 2 cups of green tea every day.

10) Vitamin D-3 or sunshine and a brisk walk 30 to 45 minutes every day.


The key appears to be breakfast. When I get breakfast right, I can actually
reduce PSA. Get it wrong, and the diet doesn't work at all.

My breakfast is 4-5 oz of "cooked" steel cut oatmeal, with walnuts, 3-5
raspberries, and zero to 2 oz of unsweetened almond milk . Do not take other
liquids within 30 minutes before, or 75 minutes after the oatmeal. I walk about
3 miles right after breakfast to improve insulin sensitivity.

I used that breakfast and the "above rules" to stop the rise of my PSA. In the
past I have totally killed a good diet by: 1) presoaking the oatmeal; 2) adding
extra "liquid" to the process; 3) adding a lot of fruit; 4) totally removing all fruit.
The entire diet became worthless, even though I kept lunch and dinner the same.

The question becomes, If you could, do you really want to kill off most of the
cancer cells and risk mutations that are resistant to the diet? I think not!
This approach is called "adaptive" or "maintenance" therapy, and is getting
attention.

Cashless


/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5187535/

Well, you at least have some great enthusiasm for your diet plan. :golf clap:

"My current baseline diet is giving me ZERO PSA growth" and "I used that breakfast and the "above rules" to stop the rise of my PSA" are what are termed "unsubstantiated testimonials". I.e., they are not necessarily factual statements and are likely based on false premises. PSA does not come from what you eat or do not eat.

While entertaining, the NIH read doesn't go quite as far as you seem to think. Yeah, eating berries is generally beneficial, but that won't prevent you getting cancer and won't cure it if you have it.

Of course, eating a healthy diet and getting enough exercise are important tools in becoming healthier or staying healthy, but I would strongly advise against thinking or stating that they constitute a cure for cancer.

It is good to get as many of ideas we can. What work for Cashless, might not work for you, but it's an excellent start to build on. Thank you for posting!

Interesting diet. Too stringent for me. I was vegetarian for 10 years prior to my PC diagnosis. After that I eat whatever, whenever.

It seems this debate has shown up any number of occasions with little resolve. Without taking sides I would simply mention that there our countries with far less PC than the USA. These same countries have several factors for this more fortunate outcome, diet, probably being one of them.

I will congratulate OP for his dedication to a diet that is obviously heart healthy! When I look at my obesity, I envy and appreciate his courage.

Heh - I have always been a fan of Mohamed Ali as well, he was a real standup guy right to the end.

Many of us here have used a ton of supplements and regimens to try and gain a measure of control over what is basically a problem that we actually have very little control over.

I am still taking several PCa - specific supplements myself (curcumin, resveritol etc) as I deem the research to be sufficiently robust for those. Has not stopped my cancer though. Had to quit the neem as I have an allergy to that, made me break out. I also retain my very healthy Mediterranean - styled diet and over-the-top daily exercise routine. I do that for my Taekwondo and lifestyle quality though, that it may benefit my cancer fight is just icing on the cake.

That said, there is no current literature that indicates any of these measures will effect my prostate cancer sufficiently to lower PSA readings. Hope is a good thing, but it is necessary to remain grounded on (scientific) reality as well.

I really believe that hope and the other virtues (and just about everything...even science)are grounded in science...it is manifested...just not discovered as yet...just another logo nonsense...that one has to sense...to "make it so"....

Domino95 . . . I'm interested in the diet information. But, don't
know how to contact you. In my experience, walnuts are neutral.
I can have excellent results with them, but they will not save a
flawed diet.


Subdenis . . .
Gleason score of biopsy 4 + 3
Gleason score of pathology 3 + 3
PSADT (pre-diet) 7 months.


trailguy says . . . ""My current baseline diet is giving me ZERO PSA growth"
and "I used that breakfast and the "above rules" to stop the rise of my PSA"
are what are termed "unsubstantiated testimonials". I.e., they are not
necessarily factual statements and are likely based on false premises.
PSA does not come from what you eat or do not eat."

trailguy . . . my post is just an update of my diet experiment with prostate
cancer. I continuously monitor my PSA as I make changes to my diet. When
the PSA at the end of a test period is unchanged from that at the beginning,
I refer to it as a "zero growth" diet. If they are to be refer to as "unsubstantiated
testimonials", I'm not sure how that adds to the conversation.

As to "PSA does not come from what you eat or do not eat." Remember, my
prostate has been removed, and I am assuming that my PSA readings are a
reflection of my prostate cancer status. So, if PSA is unchanged, I'm assuming
that my cancer is unchanged. If you are saying that food does not impact cancer
growth, I have over 5 years of data that refutes that.

Like many of us here, my prostate has also been removed so you are in good company. I have no idea what your stats are as you do not have them in your sig line for us to see. If your cancer has been cured by the removal of your gland and there is no change in your PSA reads, congratulations.

Otherwise, I assume your PSA increased after surgery and you are choosing to combat this gain with dietary changes.

PSA is produced by prostate cells, normal or cancerous. Prostate cancer cells do not necessarily produce a lot of PSA all of the time. This why some of us have what appears to be low - grade disease with low PSA reads that turn out to be very aggressive cancer despite that while others of us here have had what appears to be very serious disease that is completely 'cured' by a single therapy measure. It is not a 'one size fits all' disease and therapy results are all over the board.

Every once in a while, someone pops up here claiming that cannabis cures prostate cancer. Same with a particular diet choice.

If you really think that steel cut oatmeal is going to somehow fight your prostate cancer better than regular oatmeal, then you should eat that. If you think that eating steel cut oatmeal cures cancer and wish to convince others of that, then I must ask for links and references to the study/studies that back those extraordinary claims, just as I do with weed.

Stopping prostate cancer cells from growing, reproducing and moving from one part of your body to others(metastasizing) is something that we would all love to get done so we can stay alive. If there was a diet that was scientifically proven to do that, we here would all love to get on board, self included.

But there needs to be real, verifiable proof that such a thing actually works.

Again, a healthy diet and exercise regimen is helpful for any of us, especially those of us going through invasive treatments to try and stop a fatal disease. Pursuing a diet and exercise regimen that you believe is helpful to you gives you not only better health overall but also a feeling of control in a situation where you may well feel you have none. Minor dietary tweaks likely don't have much effect on cancer though.

I'm not sure of the difference...but think there is a difference between a study and randomized clinical trial...TA did not say a study...which is what everyone has called TA's randomized clinical trial...TA has not corrected...which I sense is because...he...like a few others here(myself for example) get frustrated...with soooo many...that do not take the time...to READ his posts...and are quick..to nuance his words into something they are not...A person can only do so much...I applaud his patience...in dealing with this...this was exhibited a short time ago with OP...I can not remember who...this happens so often who could keep track...I just keep hoping that we as a forum would stand erect...and stop being so thin skinned...we are all human beings...with many faults and stop being offended and thinking the worse of every thing that is posted...Im trying to...join me in this...there is not one fault...no not one...that the other is free from...if not in thought...then in action...the two equivocate...we are all guilty...hence subject to grace...fool yourself...but not each other...

Thanks for the update. I have been following your journey with interest.

Domino95 said...
cashlessclay,

Thank you for your posts regarding diet. My diet is 95% in correlation with yours. And it works for me too.

Please PM me if you want specific diet recommendations from a world renown Radiation Oncologist who treated me. It is not copyrighted information. His recommendations track with what you are eating, except NOT eating walnuts.

Holy cow, no walnuts? I am a goner for sure. Walnut were a specific thing I decided to add to my diet a few years back, mostly eaten on what I call my "horse feed breakfast" days. chose walnuts because they were fairly low net carb and noted for a particular form of vitamin E, a better source of that than other foods. And they were fairly high fiber(hence the low NET carb).

Though I much prefer bacon (or sausage) and eggs, on the days I am trying to be extra good, if not actually on a fast day, I will mix some organic ground flax and coconut, berries, low net carb all bran cereal, and walnuts. And some protein powder in almond milk, usually soy powder, but lately I am out and have just been using plain old whey from grass fed cows.

Over the last 4 years or so, I have done this anywhere from 2 to 4 days a week. I'm not crazy about it, but it is not too bad really. And it starts my day with a high fiber, high fat, moderate protein(all from plants unless I use whey protein) pretty low carb(between 10 and 20 gms net) and high fiber breakfast. It is also very filling and will hold me quite a while. It won't hold me as long as bacon and eggs maybe with just one slice of well buttered toast(if splurging and allowing a few carbs), or a cheese omelet, but it does pretty well.

The net carbs are low enough and fat high enough that I am hoping it only generates a minimal insulin response. It also increases my non-animal intake and plant protein, in case there is actually some benefit to that. And it does not cause me much distress such as I might get when eating things I don't really like and not eating the things I do really like.

But now I find walnuts are verbotten? Oh well, probably so is the coconut, and all of that saturated fat I eat in my steaks. And all that butter I consume liberally. Not to mention the red meat. But I think I will stick with the walnuts until I see some solid proof of harm. ( I eat some almonds also)

BillyBob@388 said...

... it does not cause me much distress such as I might get when eating things I don't really like and not eating the things I do really like.

But now I find walnuts are verbotten? Oh well, probably so is the coconut, and all of that saturated fat I eat in my steaks. And all that butter I consume liberally. Not to mention the red meat. But I think I will stick with the walnuts until I see some solid proof of harm. ( I eat some almonds also)

I'm with you on that BB. I did flax and such for a few years. Fish oil. Greens. Felt terrible. Got real sick.
Gimme lean meat, nuts, a few fruits and veggies, and restrict starches. No fried foods. And I feel good.