PCa choice by Rick K (Michigan guy)~outside the box~not known by alot of newbies

Not saying this is anybodies particular choice to make or take, but  alot of newbies (especially) don't even know this is an  option, just as w.w.-surveilance can be too. Rick K. diagnosed back around  1997 and found with gleason 5 (total 2+3) seems rare but he did not have it reviewed either (so lets assume it is a 6 total), has 2 cores of 12 that showed PCa and a psa of 10.3 or very near that number. Decided no surgery or radiation and back then it was quite a leap of faith to even consider...did hormone therapy similar to Dr. Leibowitz protocol:  ADT3:  lupron (or zoladex)+ casodex (or equals)+ proscar and take them for 13 months, then quit and take only proscar as a maintenance thing.

So, Rick says a few months after this protocol his manhood returned to normal and he was totally normal. Had rebiopsies done even later, two different times, nothing found on biopsies when taken. Well 11-12 yrs. go by and Rick has lead a perfectly normal life, no urinary issues, no e.d. etc.,  his psa did change about 1 yr or so again, so he went back on the ADT3 for 13 months, which is not unheard of in this protocol. He plans on quitting that in 13 months and stay on proscar. Now he can also still get any treatment on his PCa at any time, yes surgery would be more difficult with a gland that shrinks via those drugs (but can be done) along with any other protocols (radiations, hifu, brachy, etc.). Maybe somebody out there likes the idea of being normalish for a decade or more and then decide what roads to take, whom knows what 10yrs out we will have for treatments, then. Look at what has happened in last 10-20 yrs. of PCa history.

So can Rick die of PCa, sure and so can anyone even with treatments at any given level of PCa, low stats have the best scenarios for cures and longevity.  Did Rick enjoy being totally normal all these years???(what do you think!!) I have his phone number...I am not spreading b.s. on this. Not many docs mention this as a treatment plan, it is not identical to hormone therapy that is mono or dual therapies, although those could render maybe comparable results (at best). Not as profittable for the treating physician either, but still is proffitable...not saying these drug companies are saints either. It is just another possible choice in the PCa world..there are others too. A patient could go on emcyt or estradiol patches or DES that work against PCa, and even some other drugs.  Dr. Fred Lee uses or used emcyt on his own case of it, no surgery, no radiations etc. He has been dealing with it for well  over a decade and it living large and doing his doppler color ultrasounds (a master at such, too).  So I guess he is stupid for not having surgery or radiation?

Interesting that there are so many ways to go about dealing with PCa, for some people and depending upon their age and other variables, quality of life may be a priority first, perhaps.

Make your decision(s) on your own PCa case...only you have to walk the walk and atleast at this juncture we still have choices....that may change in 1-2 yrs. time, which would add a new parameter to all of us in treatments, food for thought too.

 

zufas,

with your friend rick, and i am sincerely glad its working for him, do you think his approach just happens to work for him in particular, say due to the uniqueness of his body, cancer, and situation, or do you think it would work just as well for others that attempted to follow his course of action?

david

if something works, it works, i am not going to argue with sucess

Brother Purgatory (zufus not zufas...as that implies the donkey version-LOL), even if it applies that way-LOL. To answer you back and for others:

Why not go to Dr.Leibowitz website (and similar) and read for yourself, the answer is in general yes it works that way, however as you have heard, there are over 12 variants of PCa often not found properly detected which one a patient really has, there are a few variants if you read about them, that do not respond to hormone therapies either at all or very limited duration....so those low percentage of men don't have alot of hope, most likely in any modality. Ones like 'Small Cell PCa' ,usually very aggressive and just plain awful...have seen posts by wives whos husband were diagnosed with such and had short life. The most disturbing post was a wife whom wrote her husband just got diagnosed with small cell, and gone (died) within two weeks.

So, yeah we have it rough being PCa patients.....count your blessing if you have atleast a treatable version of it or may die 10-15 yrs. later...that compariably is a win-win. (hows that for full glass from zufUs)? Happy even when confronted with real death scenario...in this jungle I know I am a so-journer given my original omnious stats, do I enjoy the here and now...I am rockin in paradise, smelling roses and livin la vida loca. In case we forget we all are sojourners, nobody escapes an ending in this world, just a matter of how long. In the span of what is called 'time' we comparitively lived 3 seconds vs. age of the solar system or such..it is said..yada..yada..yada. You think PCa is difficult to understand, try explaining: infinity of the universe, black holes, worm holes, time as we know it and how time travel exists. Makes our genius'es look lame even by todays standards. All we can do is try and we do fairly decent with our limited sticks and stones (per se).

Might want to read up as much as you can on estradiol patches, DES, emcyt, ketoconazole and some other drugs, chemo if you wish to (seems like chemo is good for 4-6 mos. on patients with serious PCa..other than that is palliative therapy with heavy duty side effects, from what I have seen), these are worthy of anybodies time whom is facing recurrence and psa increases after treatments and salvage therapies. We have many choices on how you wish to fight this or how long or even not to do so. Your life, should be your decision, your call...only you walk the walk and will forget the talked and talked.