How do we help the new guys?

Excellent question(s)! IMO, if there's a place where we let the new guys down is when we get off track and end up debating various points. Diversity of opinion is okay--in fact, it's very good, but when we start playing intramurals with each other, then I think we're detracting, not adding value.

Re medical advice: I myself don't know the line there. I'd like to hear what folks say about that.

Fully agree that everyone's heart is in the right place. We're all on the same team here.

Be yourself and let the chips fall

Fair enough , Logo Everyone is capable of believing or not what they hear, you are your own advocate, so it's all on you.

While I know I'm not always successful at it, I always try to share my experience--what I did, why I did it, and what happened and how it came out. I once was told that advice giving is dangerous because then I bear some responsibility for the outcome if my advice is taken.

I do agree however, that if a newbie comes in and his questions lead us down one of the common rabbit holes, that is not a good thing.

Pratoman said...
Just a question that I think is worth throwing out there.

So where is that line?

somewhere around here: X

I offer my experience, my support and what little knowledge I have.

and spend a lot of time saying, "Don't worry."

and the occasional bad poem.

and often I point out that I am not a doctor, just some random guy on the internet.

Got to go write a poem about flowers and sunshine and beer.

Peace, love and lemon drops,
Andrew

Pratoman said...

Clearly, there are guys like Tall ALlen,

Don't you guys mess with my TA. He knows his S$%* so just do what he says and always give him the last word.

dudes...

Well, one thing we can do is refer them to the sticky notes.

We may not be doctors, but WE KNOW A LOT. Really, we do.

I found from reading a ton of posts, I learn a lot from the collective wisdom of the group (the key is COLLECTIVE). So, I would encourage new folks to read a lot of posts, after reading the sticky notes.

Some advice will jump out, such as getting second opinions, finding good, experienced medicos, taking your time,investigating a variety of treatments, etc.

Prat -- while we can always improve, I think one of HW's strengths is that new, scared folks can start gaining some knowledge and a lot of support here.

Mel

I think everyone knows that what you find on the internet can be anything between great wisdom and hogwash.

I seriously doubt that the members of this forum may be of greater disservice to new members than the disservice some have seen in the medical community.

Why is there such a clear need to tell other members they need to be their own advocate? Granted, that path is not for everyone.

When you have major leaders in the field talking about 30% overtreatment, and others talking about losing "screening" something is wrong.

Geetar Man said it quite well. So did Compiler

GeetarMan said...
..really good stuff snipped.....Also... some of the "medical advice" you will get here is better, and easier to understand than what some folks get from their docs, especially primary care docs and urologists. I have seen examples of incredibly bad advice and care by so-called medical professionals.... YOU NEED TO LEARN ENOUGH TO BE YOUR OWN ADVOCATE!

I hate to think what path I might be on had I not found this forum.

Absolutely top notch. I have seen nothing I would think was a disservice to a new member in the 3 months I have been here.

Personally I think you guys have the balance just about smack on right...

Even as a newb it hasn't taken me long to figure out who has their head screwed on the right way and who ate too many paint-chips as a kid; and of course that TA sits on the right hand of God. I KNOW it falls to me to listen, filter and interpret, this is the internet after all and I think people 'get' that these days. We're adults, we are responsible for ourselves, our choices and their consequences.

When lecturing my students at Hopkins, every year I make the same joke:

"What do you call a Dr who was bottom of his class?"

They laugh, then shuffle nervously, then you see the "oh crap" realization spread across their faces... then I know I have their attention.

I wouldn't change much or beat yourselves up any... I would not have wanted a different experience joining you here than the one I had and am having. You have saved my sanity, my marriage and will quite probably save my life. Frankly I'd buy every single one of you a beer if I could, even the paint-chippers have taught me something along the way.

Yes there is the occasional argument that has me shaking my head and saying "does this add value guys?", but I also know that I am not 'everyone' and it may help someone else in a different way. I DO KNOW that some of the arguments have actually helped me... I formed an opinion about something and a counter-point post made me question that opinion in the light of new knowledge and perspective; and revise my opinion. In that respect it's like politics... as a responsible adult, you should listen 'in the round' not just filter what you want to hear; else you end up living in a compound.

Paul

I believe that most people affected by PCa come here for medical advice; therefore , if TA, or others, give them medical information newbies get what they want. They know they are asking for advice from folks who have gone through the pain PCa .... not medical practioners.

Also, I believe that these people are aware that this is an open forum and that they will probably experience a difference of opinion. I wish I had received the insight of those who are passionate about their PCa choices.

It would be nice if we could handle our differences in a cordial fashion.

Prato, this is an excellent topic IMHO. Well worth taking the time to sit back and examine.

I actually think Paul65 expressed my position pretty well. This forum is a wealth of knowledge and our members are generally pretty passionate about their positions. And the knowledgeable ones like TA can back the opinions up with facts. Yeah, the debates get a little heated from time to time but I have heard more than once from new members that they find this helpful rather than off-putting since it makes options more clear. The only real problems come when we get over the line on the rules that the site owner has established for us.

Regarding medical advice, here is a quote from the ultra-top-secret-need-to-know-eyes-only Moderator FAQ's. the question is: "Can Members Give Medical Advice?"

The answer from our site owner/administrator is:

"Yes, by all means. It is not against the rules for members to share their opinions about medical treatments or to offer medical advice. I don't want to inhibit the sharing of information or opinions.

There is a guideline to members to use good judgement and not to rely on others for medical advice. At some point members must accept responsibility for themselves.

The forums are really about sharing. I think it is okay to offer referrals to medical doctors, or hospitals, or suggest a treatment that worked for one person.

I know we all have our biases about what constitutes good treatment, often cast as traditional verses alternative approaches, but we should try to keep an open mind about these kind of discussions.

There will be some "bad" information in our forums and if you disagree with it, you are free to state your opinion (ie. such as disagreeing with someone offering a strange or unusual treatment), but we should try hard not to disrupt the sharing aspect of the forums among members."

Jim

Paul:

Well-put. My family doctor long ago said my knowledge outstrips his in the PC area. But this is good, because he is most willing to follow my suggestions, garnered from my PC specialist.
My local urologist has said the same thing. She gives me my Lupron shot, as needed, dictated by Dr. Lam.

This does not make me a genius. My knowledge is dwarfed by so many who post here.

Look, the fact is we have a specific life-threatening major disease. Of course, we are going to try and find out as much as we can about it (at least those who post here regularly). Our doctors, who treat a variety of ailments, don't have the time nor the inclination to do that for PC.

This is a very good topic.

Mel