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PSA increase 3 years after surgery?
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10drum
Regular Member
Joined : May 2013
Posts : 103
Posted 5/28/2016 10:49 AM (GMT 0)
Greetings,
I apologize for being absent from this form for 2 years. After I was diagnosed with lung cancer in 2014, my prostate cancer took a back seat
I just returned from MD Anderson for my 6 month CT scan on my lungs. The results of the scan were good, however my psa went from undetectable to .3 during the last 6 months.
My thoracic surgeon contacted my urologist, but it was late on Friday before a long weekend, so I probably won't hear anything until next week sometime.
I have done some research, read a few blogs, I understand about
doubling rate, and about
what may be next. I just thought I'd ask here if there is anyone here, whose "been there/done that"? This has been a real blow to me, I need help dealing with this, and need to hear something positive.
Thanks for all replies
Dreamerboy
Veteran Member
Joined : Jul 2011
Posts : 601
Posted 5/28/2016 12:20 PM (GMT 0)
First of all, I wish you the best as I know that it cannot be easy.
The only advice I would give is to try to find a philosophy of life to help you through this. In one way we are fortunate to be in this age of communication because you can search what philosophical approach other people in similar circumstances used to help them deal with such situations. You will probably find many other people's approaches don't work for you but every once in a while something will stick that provides a strong sense of comfort.
It would also probably help to join a cancer support group as you can get good advice/support from others going through similar challenges.
Pratoman
Forum Moderator
Joined : Nov 2012
Posts : 9890
Posted 5/28/2016 12:33 PM (GMT 0)
10drum, tough breaks you've had the last two years and now this, it's understandable how you feel.
My first question would be, is this one test? If it is, I would ask for a retest. That's a pretty big jump for 6 months, especially after 3 years of undetectable. So be sure it's not a bad reading. It happens.
That aside, assuming it's real, yup, it's distressing. Focus on the fact that so much can be done to manage this disease after BCR, and this is by no means a death sentence. Look at guys like Todd, and others, who've done really well considering their diagnosis. No doubt you'll get the best care possible, and you WILL get this under control.
Hang in there, it's not just a recurrence you may be dealing with, it's a Mnd adjustment. You'll be ok. Lots of uncertainty right now, once you get past that, you'll manage thru this,
10drum
Regular Member
Joined : May 2013
Posts : 103
Posted 5/28/2016 1:38 PM (GMT 0)
Thanks Pratoman, I have no doubt they will want me to retest right away, and again in a few months. I was really hoping this visit would would be my 2 years post lung, and 3 years post prostate. It has been really difficult to put all this behind me. I will do whatever they recommend.
I noticed your PSA's. MDA only reads to 0.0. I ask them about
the 0.01 I got at 3 months out from my local hospital, and MDA said they consider anything under 0.0 is undetectable. I kept getting checked @ MDA, because I was going there for the lung anyway. I do have confidence in those people down there in Texas, but I do wonder what that hundredth digit would've shown over the last 3 years.
10drum
Regular Member
Joined : May 2013
Posts : 103
Posted 5/28/2016 1:41 PM (GMT 0)
Dreamerboy, I am part of immerman angles, and the cancer connection at MDA. It does help but I posted here hoping to hear from someone who has been there, done that. Thanks for the reply.
InTheShop
Elite Member
Joined : Jan 2012
Posts : 11468
Posted 5/28/2016 2:21 PM (GMT 0)
I vote for a retest. You need to confirm that number.
If it is rising, you have a few options on the table. Lots of guys here been down that path.
Andrew
Fairwind
Veteran Member
Joined : Jul 2010
Posts : 4107
Posted 5/28/2016 5:12 PM (GMT 0)
There are scans now that can spot metastasized prostate cancer at very low levels. The results of one of these scans can be very helpful in putting together a treatment program and determining if full pelvic SRT will be effective or not... Cancer treatment is a lot more effective if you know exactly where the cancer is..
Best of luck to you...
10drum
Regular Member
Joined : May 2013
Posts : 103
Posted 5/28/2016 5:38 PM (GMT 0)
InTheShop, Thanks for the reply. I'm afraid the test was probably accurate, because on my spring trip to MDA I go to the St Lukes heart hospital for cardio screening, (they are who first found the tumor in my lung with a standard chest X-ray). They do a blood work up on me and just so happens they checked my PSA also, (they usually don't). Well it was .3 also from a different lab.
Fairwind, What is HT like? It appears to work
Howard3569
Veteran Member
Joined : Nov 2014
Posts : 630
Posted 5/28/2016 9:44 PM (GMT 0)
Hang in there. Good luck
10drum
Regular Member
Joined : May 2013
Posts : 103
Posted 5/29/2016 2:09 PM (GMT 0)
Howard, that's all we can do, is to hang in there. Your PSAs are a perfect example of what I referred to earlier. MDA considers any PSA below 0.1 as undetectable. My local hospital's lab gives PSA's to the nearest hundredth. I did not want to see that 2nd digit when I started the testing. Now I sort of wish I did, perhaps Friday's result wouldn't have been such a shock. Thanks for the reply.
island time
Veteran Member
Joined : Dec 2014
Posts : 2388
Posted 5/29/2016 4:15 PM (GMT 0)
With those 4's there my guess is it's a good reading. Hopefully it's not but I'm like you, I believe I'd be getting a game plan together now. I'm not an expert on this. I read up on it a few mos. ago just out of curiosity (pos. margin in my case). I've forgotten everything I've read doubling rates confused me anyhow.
They'll be people come along that's had SRT.. What would be nice to know is what the studies are showing if one does have SRT as far as cure rates with your pathology. "Tripled in 3 years" is really all you've got to go on. I would think a shot of Lupron would be the first thing they'd want to give you. (But I'm not certain of that). But if so...my brother-in-law has suffered minimal to no side effects in the year and a half he's been on it.
There's also been some salvages done now with SBRT. A couple of guys will chime in on having done this. You might ask MDA if they offer this in case you need it. Someone here will know more about
this. And they'll chime in.
The biggie is that your lung cancer seems to have been caught. That was the real bear in the room and he's no longer around. This other will be managed one way or another for years to come.
Sorry I couldn't be more helpful.
10drum
Regular Member
Joined : May 2013
Posts : 103
Posted 5/29/2016 4:39 PM (GMT 0)
Island time, Thanks for offing some fore sight as to what my treatment might be. I stated in my original thread, that I have been away from this forum since the lung cancer. I realize I should've stayed, because I could have offered some insight to those, who may have been where I was 3 years ago. It was real discouraging not finding a lung cancer forum. I just assumed no one lived long enough to post, so yes, as my family doctor told me, "I'm one lucky dude".
May I assume SRT stands for Salvage Radiation Treatment? What does "B" in SBRT stand for?
Thanks for the reply.
island time
Veteran Member
Joined : Dec 2014
Posts : 2388
Posted 5/29/2016 4:58 PM (GMT 0)
My brother-in-law's dad had that stuff. Everyone was all up in arms thinking "it was over". He was 66 or so when diagnosed. Went to the community hospital here in E. TN for treatment (the operation). He did die. When he was 81. Something about
his throat was messed up is what got him. Nothing at all to do with lung cancer. Stossel on Fox network just had his cut out. He's been given the green light as well.
Yes. SRT is salvage radiation therapy. SBRT is the latest stuff. It's "hypo - fractionated". Kills the stuff as well as any of the 40 or so treatments of old. I'm not sure what it stands for. Google it or just hit the search button on this forum. Type in SBRT prostate. Or better yet..."SBRT Salvage prostate"" and see what comes up.
There's some guys on here one in particular that's all over this stuff. They'll be here in the bye and bye.
EDIT: "SBRT salvage prostate" is what you want to type in in the search function of this forum. But...i don't even know that you need it. Lots a good reading material there though.
10drum
Regular Member
Joined : May 2013
Posts : 103
Posted 5/29/2016 5:59 PM (GMT 0)
Island time, SBRT - Stereotactic Body Radiation Treatment. I think aka. Gamma knife
MDA was offering this to treat my lung cancer with some incentives, like no deductible, and other incentives just to get people to try it, so they could build some data. What data they had was promising, so I ask the surgeon what I should do, and he said, "I'm a surgeon, I want to cut it out, and surgery has proven to be effective, I'll send you to the radiologist if you want". I had him cut it out. I really like the guy, he is a very impressive man. If you have time, search Dr Ara Vaporciyan.
I was so scared because the prostate surgery was horrible. The lung surgery was a cake walk compared to the prostate. We rented the same apartment in Houston for the recovery. I didn't leave the apartment for 2 weeks after my p surgery, except to be taken to the emergency room for the hiccups. I was sitting by the pool drinking beer with my daughter 5 days after the lung surgery. We were going to the zoo, the museums, and galveston. It was almost like a vacation, probably because of the refillable script
to norco.
Anyway, SBRT may be encouraging for me if necessary. Thank you so much, this is what I asking for, when I started this thread.
Ps. I'm a libertarian, so yes, I know all about
Mr Stossel.
Phil
Fairwind
Veteran Member
Joined : Jul 2010
Posts : 4107
Posted 5/29/2016 8:35 PM (GMT 0)
Drum, the side effects of HT are nasty. There are several threads running on this board about
them..NOBODY would submit to ADT but since it's so effective we have little choice...It works and it works very well...It's the lesser or two evils..Surrender your manhood or die...That's a rock and a hard place.....
F8
Veteran Member
Joined : Feb 2010
Posts : 5892
Posted 5/29/2016 11:34 PM (GMT 0)
hah Fairwind
. it's funny how our descript
ion of chemical castration evolves over time
ed
10drum
Regular Member
Joined : May 2013
Posts : 103
Posted 5/30/2016 12:20 AM (GMT 0)
Fair wind, my manhood left with my prostate, it never woke up, there are ways to make it work, but my wife said she'd rather have a live steer than a dead bull. Thanks for the reply. Phil
maldugs
Veteran Member
Joined : Jun 2007
Posts : 814
Posted 5/30/2016 12:50 AM (GMT 0)
Hi 10drum, I had no choice but to go on Zoladex after my PSA shot up last year, ( I guess I did have a choice, but did not like the alternative) when I had my RP 9 years ago, my Psa came in at 0.5, I have never had a zero, the side effects are not too bad, and the effect on my PSA have been dramatic, from 11.70 to 0.03 in 6 months, I have been impotent since the operation, but at age 76, really not bothered, I really do hope you and your doctors can come to a reasonable plan of action.
Best Regards Mal.
10drum
Regular Member
Joined : May 2013
Posts : 103
Posted 5/30/2016 3:17 AM (GMT 0)
Maldugs, I think I can guess what the alternative was? Thanks for the reply.
Michael_T
Veteran Member
Joined : Sep 2012
Posts : 4103
Posted 5/30/2016 3:43 AM (GMT 0)
Don't get libido mixed up with ED. I'm just surmising that what's you're referring to re the "never woke up" comment, but they are two completely different things.
But...you're really jumping ahead here. You likely have SRT in your future...that has a pretty darn good chance of mopping up anything that has been hanging out the last there years and has (belatedly) caused a rise in your PSA. That may or may not involve hormone therapy as an adjunct. (Re HT, I've done it...it isn't fun, but it's also not the end of the world if it's a short regimen.)
Presumably, you have connections at MDA to steer you through this? I'm no doctor, but a small rise in PSA after three years--while clearly not what you wanted--still seems very treatable to me.
10drum
Regular Member
Joined : May 2013
Posts : 103
Posted 5/30/2016 11:26 AM (GMT 0)
Thanks for the reply Michael_T. It is difficult not to jump ahead. I hope to know more by the end of the week.
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