HealingWell
Search Close Search
☰

DR Myers approach

Support Forums
>
Prostate Cancer
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply
❬ ❬ Previous Thread |Next Thread ❭ ❭
Posted 2/6/2018 11:49 PM (GMT 0)
I have heard Dr Myers approach to slow down the progression of PC with
Guys who have PSADT>9 months, he suggests using Avodart instead of HT.
He says on one of his videos that it’s very drug and very effective to achieve a complete durable remission.
Does anyone have experience with this approach please?
Thank you
Posted 2/6/2018 11:58 PM (GMT 0)
Let's see the data in a peer-reviewed journal. Anyone can make any conjecture they want (and there are many such videos) - it doesn't make it true. It is a testable hypothesis.
Posted 2/7/2018 12:00 AM (GMT 0)
He was talking I think about the ARTS trial
Posted 2/7/2018 12:25 AM (GMT 0)
Here's the link:
www.europeanurology.com/article/S0302-2838(12)01337-1/fulltext

As you can see, it did not achieve a "complete durable remission," it only extended the time to disease progression compared to a placebo. It says nothing about dutasteride vs ADT. And it offers no data on whether it improves survival. So, I guess you can conclude that a 5ARI may be better than doing nothing at all.
Posted 2/7/2018 1:37 AM (GMT 0)
Avodart/Proscar has long been used in the triple ADT. That is normally lupron, casodex and avodart. This stops the production of T, blocks the use of T and stops the production of DHT. it was started by Dr Lebowietz and used by Myers and others as the triple blockade. I used it as well as my urologist was instrumental in many studies of Avodart and the effect on PCa. Myers pioneered the use of Avodart as a low side effect method of controlling PCA while on a Lupron holiday. His point is that DHT is some 10 times more powerful than gonadal T and if you suppress the DHT then a remission is more likely to be achieved.
Posted 2/7/2018 1:39 AM (GMT 0)
I certainly wouldn't discount the value of extending doubling time. The bottom line is that it's all about doubling time. As an oversimplistic example, suppose that a PSA of 200 represents a fatal situation. Starting at 0.2, that's about 10 doublings. At a 6 month doubling rate that's 5 years survivability but at 2 year doubling that's 20 years, which might be fine for a 60 or 70 year old.

I realize doubling rates aren't constant etc but, aside from a curative intervention, lengthening doubling time may be the most important factor to control. If Avodart, broccoli, or a frog's eyeball extends doubling time, that would be a good thing. Maybe one could extend doubling time with benign agents enough to roll the dice with watchful waiting vs struggling with ADT. If they fail to slow DT then ADT is always there, as long as you don't wait until the cancer burden is too high.
Posted 2/7/2018 2:06 AM (GMT 0)
Good point on doubling times. JohnT has often said that we get 40 doubles with cancer and then we are dead. I am sure there is a bit more nuance based on the type of cancer but the point is that at some point the cancer overwhelmed the body and lights out. So if we delay and slow the doubling process we extend survival. That is what remission is all about. I figure that before diagnosis I had a fairly rapid doubling time and if untreated I would probably be in the 6,000 PSA range by now. That I was treated and have gone seven years undetectable means I have at least bought seven years of survival. A good thing from my perspective.
Posted 2/7/2018 2:30 AM (GMT 0)
We have to be careful about using PSADT as a surrogate endpoint for survival. It is just one of many factors that enter into it. It is certainly a prognostic factor, but it is only one. We want to make sure that we aren't just treating the PSA - we want to treat the underlying disease.

The use of 5ARIs as part of a hormone cocktail (a GnRH agonist, an anti-androgen, and a 5ARi), sometimes called ADT3, was hyped for awhile. But then Klotz did an actual randomized clinical trial. What he found was that those who continuously used a 5ARi, even on the off-cycle, actually did no better than those who stopped using it altogether on their vacations.

/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4250242/
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply