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NEW Probiotic coming soon!!

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Posted 10/24/2011 5:45 PM (GMT 0)
Only thing that confuses me is stating that iron levels are high during active IBD... My levels tank due to loss of blood....

http://www.emaxhealth.com/1275/new-probiotic-may-treat-inflammatory-bowel-disease[
Posted 10/24/2011 6:49 PM (GMT 0)
Yeah I read the article and I thought that seemed to come from left field too...
Posted 10/25/2011 7:26 AM (GMT 0)
Thanx for sharing!

"For inflammatory bowel disease, which mainly includes Crohn’s disease and ulcerative colitis, much of the success has come from helping patients maintain remission rather than in treating active disease. But why?"
Posted 10/25/2011 10:55 AM (GMT 0)
Thanks for your interest in this research. I am part of the team involved in developing this probiotic. Unfortunately some of the articles that have been published about this research have become somewhat lost in translation. To clarify, what we actually state is that iron levels are increased in the intestine either due to bleeding directly from the gut or from oral iron supplementation. Iron levels in your blood will decrease during active IBD but will be increased in the gut. Since a probiotic will need to be able to actively compete in the gut we propose that it needs to be able to respond to iron as many other bacteria do. We have identified a strain of bacteria which is able to do this and suggest that it could be used as a probiotic in IBD patients. You can find the original article here:

http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0026507
Posted 10/25/2011 3:35 PM (GMT 0)
Many thanks for being active on this forum. I have a question. Generally, doctors or probiotic manufacturers will state that you need to increase consumption of probiotics during active IBD. For example, VSL#3's website advises to double or quadruple dosage during active IBD. Is it your opinion that this increased dosage is insufficient or ineffective, and if so why?
Posted 10/25/2011 3:56 PM (GMT 0)
We suggest that an ability to compete with other bacteria in the iron-rich environment of the intestine has not often been considered by probiotic manufacturers before now. The lactic acid bacteria which are frequently used as probiotics often cannot compete in this environment and are therefore ineffective. Therefore, it seems sensible to increase the dose of probiotics during active IBD, simply to increase the numbers in your gut. However, I cannot comment on the ability of the VSL#3 strains to survive this harsh environment as I have not tested their response to iron. Certainly the vast majority of probiotics tested by us were not capable of increasing growth in response to iron and would therefore be unable to be competitive during active IBD. In my opinion, increasing the dose of a probiotic which is not iron responsive during an IBD flare would be ineffective which is why it is so important to characterise the strains of bacteria used as probiotics.
Posted 10/25/2011 4:47 PM (GMT 0)

JBailey said...
Unfortunately some of the articles that have been published about this research have become somewhat lost in translation. To clarify, what we actually state is that iron levels are increased in the intestine either due to bleeding directly from the gut or from oral iron supplementation. Iron levels in your blood will decrease during active IBD but will be increased in the gut. Since a probiotic will need to be able to actively compete in the gut we propose that it needs to be able to respond to iron as many other bacteria do. We have identified a strain of bacteria which is able to do this and suggest that it could be used as a probiotic in IBD patients. You can find the original article here:

http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0026507

 

Now that clarifies it for me.

q

Posted 10/25/2011 5:44 PM (GMT 0)
Sounds great. It's good people are looking at the disease from all different angles. Like someone else said thanks so much for takng the time to describe this to us and give us more detail. I hope your trials go very well. When are you hoping to have something approved and marketable?
Posted 10/25/2011 5:59 PM (GMT 0)
Interesting concept, hopefully we will not have to wait for 5 years to try it out.

This line of thought is interesting in that to control UC then perhaps control of bleeding first is necessary,or chelation and lowered meat/iron/heme consumption.  Of course vegetarians get UC,but then again there is lots of iron in certain veggies,fortified cereal.  It also seems that up to 90% of dietary iron is not absorbed,so where does it go, into your colon.

There is pleanty of info on medline implicating meat and UC, but almost nothing on chelation.

Here is a study from Japan.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19120872

Old Mike

 

Post Edited (Old Mike) : 10/25/2011 1:27:12 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 10/25/2011 6:20 PM (GMT 0)

JBailey said...
Thanks for your interest in this research. I am part of the team involved in developing this probiotic. Unfortunately some of the articles that have been published about this research have become somewhat lost in translation. To clarify, what we actually state is that iron levels are increased in the intestine either due to bleeding directly from the gut or from oral iron supplementation. Iron levels in your blood will decrease during active IBD but will be increased in the gut. Since a probiotic will need to be able to actively compete in the gut we propose that it needs to be able to respond to iron as many other bacteria do. We have identified a strain of bacteria which is able to do this and suggest that it could be used as a probiotic in IBD patients. You can find the original article here:

http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0026507

Hi JBailey,

Clearly two different iron levels being discussed plasma vs intestinal. Intestinal increase is due to bleeding while supplements may or may not increase the level in the large intestine ( Ulcerative Colitis ). "Most iron is absorbed in the small intestines. Gastrointestinal disorders that result in inflammation of the small intestine may result in diarrhea, poor absorption of dietary iron, and iron depletion."

Would you say that enteric coated iron pills which many UC sufferers purchase to avoid GI upset would not be absorbed completely in the small intestine and could wind up in the large intestine where they inhibit the probiotic growth ? If so what do you recommend we do in order to increase our iron intake ? Simply eat iron rich foods like spinach ?

"Taking the supplement in divided doses and with food also may help limit these symptoms. Iron from enteric coated or delayed-release preparations may have fewer side effects, but is not as well absorbed and not usually recommended".

ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/iron

Thank you
Posted 10/25/2011 6:32 PM (GMT 0)
 

Balancing the bacterial spectrum seems to be the way to go for IBD research..

Either:

by fecal transplant, or

by probiotics like Dietzia http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21460639 or VSL or 

by fasting on carbs (to reduce some of them both good and bad) like SCD or juice fast or enteral feeding

by reseting/zeroing them all by combo antibiotics and hope for a good start again.. (triple therapy)

Meanwhile, strengthen the immune system..

Regards

 

Posted 10/25/2011 6:49 PM (GMT 0)
^Why would you technically want to strengthen the immune system when anti-inflamatory drugs work to lower the immune system as the disease is linked to the immune system which causes the flare up (as far as we know). So therefore a supressed immune system is far more beneficial in terms of keeping in remission? Alough a low immune system isn't good for general health but in terms of UC it is right?
Posted 10/25/2011 8:09 PM (GMT 0)
Thank you for all your comments. This research is still very much in its early stages and one of the reasons for publicising it was to get the opinions of not only the scientific community but also patients so your input is very much appreciated. Unfortunately I can't give you any idea of how long it will take us to get this to market, like I said, it's early days but everyone involved is very keen to get it into trials asap and we are working on this. With regards to iron supplements, I'm not a medic, I'm a scientist so I'm not in a position to give you advice on what medication to take. However, it is my understanding that iron supplements contain a much higher level of iron than is actually needed as iron is rather poorly absorbed. Therefore there is likely to be an excess of iron in the gut no matter which oral supplements you take. Since these are necessary to replenish the iron lost through bleeding we are looking to develop a probiotic which could work alongside them and act to reduce the inflammation.
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