OT Covid vaccine

This doctor was talking about people who don't know that they have a lot of antibodies and take vaccine at this particular time

ewafromwarsaw said...
people who underwent covid without any symptoms might be at risk taking the vaccine. The problem is that they may still have a lot of covid antibodies which, combined with a set of extra antibodies provided by the vaccine, can be overwhelming to a healthy immunological system.

I am not sure but you might be referring to why they had so much trouble trying to develop a coronavirus vaccine until now. The following might be what you are talking about:

https://childrenshealthdefense.org/news/covid-19-robert-f-kennedy-jr-and-del-bigtree-talk-about-the-vaccine/
The government has been trying for almost thirty years to develop a coronavirus vaccine, and it’s been unsuccessful.
Beginning in 2002 there were three outbreaks of coronavirus. We called them SARS at that point and MERS...
they developed about 35 vaccines. Four of them were really promising. They chose the four most promising, and they gave them to ferrets, which is the animal that is most analogous when it comes to upper lung respiratory infections.

The ferrets had a brilliant, robust and durable antibody response. Then something horrible happened. When those ferrets were challenged, when they were exposed to the wild virus they got horribly sick. They got inflammation throughout their bodies, and they died.
They realized that there was something that they called enhanced immune response. It’s also called pathogenic priming.

What it means is that when you get the vaccine, it appears that you have an antibody response. But when you actually encounter the wild virus, you actually become much sicker, and it actually creates a pathway that that virus hurts you a lot more than with unvaccinated people.

Post Edited (IamCurious) : 12/16/2020 10:43:36 AM (GMT-7)

I'll be taking it the first chance I get. My wife is a front line medical provider, so her employer might give it to the whole family. Obviously high-risk people should be taking it first. That should take the death rate way down in no time.
I really don't care what Fauci thinks. He is old school (80 years old!), Science is bigger than one man.

C_G_K said...
I really don't care what Fauci thinks. He is old school (80 years old!), Science is bigger than one man.

Old Hat said...
Dr. Fauci is not "old school" just because he's nearing 80. He has been heavily involved with AIDS research for most of his career and even received the Presidential Medal of Freedom (USA) for his devotion to assisting politically activist patient groups in obtaining government help with their many critical issues.

Two people with two different opinions. Apparently Dr. Kary Mullis, who won the Noble Prize for inventing the PCR test, also doesn't have a high opinion of Anthony Fauci. OTOH this may be the case of professional jealousy because Fauci is world famous.

https://youtu.be/vpe_ha0nlgs

NCOT, I haven't heard that it's going to be for perpetuity! I've heard that it is until a certain percentage of the population is immunized (was it 80% ? or something?), and then we achieve the much ballyhooed "herd immunity". The estimates I've heard is September 2021. A long time, you bet. But not perpetuity.

NiceCupOfTea said...
How long are we expected to carry on like this for, for a virus with a 1% death rate?

Actually the overall covid mortality rate is much lower than 1 percent.
Covid Mortality Risk by Age:
0-24: 1 in 250,000
25-44: 1 in 16,666
45-65: 1 in 2,500
65+: 1 in 500

Hindsight is 20/20 but given these mortality statistics perhaps we should have made it a priority to first protect the elderly and then proceed with a lockdown policy similar to Sweden, rather than Wuhan.

Granted Sweden admits error early in this pandemic by not isolating and protecting their nursing homes and elderly care facilities from the getgo.  That policy has changed and despite that early blunder, Sweden's long term fatality rate is still comparable with the average European fatality rate.

But now with a minimal lockdown with no masks, and schools that have always remained open, Sweden, despite a huge increase in the number of 'cases', has been experiencing about zero fatality rate since June.

Unlike some other countries that went into strict lockdown and are now trying to open up, Sweden is not having a '2nd wave'. (Of course Sweden's elderly continue to be protected).

Old Hat said...
Why would anyone wish for a Wuhan-type lockdown? Wuhan is where the COVID-19 catastrophe started, obviously because their "wonderful" govt shut up the physicians who were trying to alert the public that this coronavirus was a major disaster! And then others disparage Dr. Fauci, who understands the origins and evolution of pandemics. Why not point the finger at the sleazy, corrupt authoritarian politicians and national leaders who only care about their own financial prospects, not about suffering, poverty, or death of millions of other people, spout populist baloney, and ignore the scientific method. These self-aggrandizers totally ignored the ongoing pandemic threats that West Nile, SARS, MERS, Ebola, and Zika forecast! Our supreme egomaniac U.S. piece of work even disbanded a pandemic task force established by his humanitarian predecessor in the wake of Ebola. The widespread shutdowns were a last resort and an economic disaster for the poor, and lower-to-middle class self-employed, factory, and small business workers, while the wealthy have fared quite well and social media moguls profit most of all from COVID-19. The wealthy always find an "out" in today's world. That's my take on it and those greedy, selfish devils totally disgust me. / Old Hat

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSssss

Dr. Fauci is a humanitarian! He stated publically that his job is to save lives, not to worry about the stock market. The people who keep trying to put him down are the ones who engage in politics here and should keep their reprehensible self-righteous attitudes to themselves. / Old Hat

Yes, I heard from a friend in Tasmania that their state leader especially took the COVID-19 threat seriously. Some people who tested positive had to quarantine in north coast hotels to curb any spread, and a bloke who sneaked out one evening to visit his girlfriend got fined $2,000. Plus Australia already had a lot to deal with when COVID cases turned up, owing to their disastrous wildfires earlier on. / Old Hat

@Poopydoop - It's just got a whole lot more complicated! On top of the 3 existing tiers, tier 4 has just been added, as well as new guidelines on what the different tiers can do over Christmas. Tier 4 is basically lockdown + not being allowed to have anyone over for Christmas, not even on Christmas Day. It covers London and the south east and starts at midnight tonight - train stations were packed this evening with thousands of Londoners fleeing London before the travel ban kicks in. Taking the mutated and up to 70% more contagious virus with them! What could possibly go wrong?

You are right about our borders too. We have completely squandered our natural advantage as an island. For the whole 9 months, we've never even had checks at Heathrow. Supposedly there is a fine if you don't self-isolate after returning from abroad, but there is no follow up and hardly anyone does it.

Unfortunately I think the anti-mask/lockdown movement has infiltrated every western country now. I have some sympathy with the anti-lockdown arguments, but none at all with the anti-maskers. Wearing a mask is such an easy thing to do and if there is a possibility of reducing community transmission, I'll do it. Do these 'sceptics' also refuse to wear a mask when they see a doctor? 'Cos it's the same principle - retail staff, bus drivers, doctors, nurses, etc. are all taking a far greater risk of contracting Covid than your Covid-denying ass is.

I do get what you mean and unfortunately I don't think it will work. We are facing a turd storm in January come what may.

They didn't cut corners in making the vaccine. It was done fast because they had unprecedented cooperation between government, big pharma, manufacturers and distributors. That's what emergency powers can do.

What worries me about the vaccine is that it's the world's first mRNA vaccine. While this tech isn't new, it's the first time it's been used on humans and on such a wide scale. If you read the research, the biggest concern is auto-immune disease. mRNA modifies the host cell's DNA, which means it changes your genetics.

I want to see a 4 year trial on this with long-term studies. They made up for the short term development by having a really high number of test subjects: 30,000. The problem is that it doesn't make up for the lack of long-term studies. It also uses nanotech to encapsulate the manufactured mRNA, and nanotech itself has implications in auto-immune.

This vaccine is basically a mass experiment in some ways. The short term trials look really good. The long term...? Well, we don't have any.

I won't be lining up for this. Not until we get a lot of post-consumer data on what happens to people when they take it. For all we know it could cause auto-immune or genetic cancers. I'm not saying this is true I'm saying we don't even know the risks because there's NO DATA.

I'm not anti-vax or pro-vax, I'm smart vax. Covid is scary but I am not clamouring for a quick fix. There is so much data showing that high doses of vitamin D3 prevent serious covid disease. Virtually everyone who gets hospitalized has low D3 levels. D3 stabilizes the cardiovascular epithelium, which is what the virus tends to rupture, causing blood clotting and low oxygenation. The virus uses the vitamin D receptor to more efficiently enter the body, which it can't do if the receptor is pre-occupied with vitamin D. Why the news media isn't talking about this more and why the health authorities aren't calling for mass vitamin D supplementation worldwide is beyond me.

Well I for one will be taking the vaccine the first opportunity I get. It doesn't alter your DNA - that's YouTube-level nonsense: https://www.gavi.org/vaccineswork/will-mrna-vaccine-alter-my-dna

As for Vitamin D, a mass supplementation programme isn't a bad idea, especially in the sun-deficient north and with people spending more time indoors in general this year. But the chances of Vitamin D being sufficient to stop the Covid pandemic on its own range from none to zero. https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4912

Edit: Oh, and the UK is becoming persona non grata faster than the new coronavirus strain is spreading: Iran is the latest in a list of countries who have banned flights from the UK. For the first time I'm scared. So far we don't know if this new strain is more lethal or virulent; or whether it will impede the vaccine or not. Somebody from Public Health England has said there is evidence that people with the new strain had "higher viral loads." Even if the virus isn't more lethal in itself, higher viral loads tend to equal more severe disease (as we've already seen with healthcare professionals exposed to massive doses, unfortunately).

I'm very uneasy right now.

Post Edited (NiceCupOfTea) : 12/20/2020 1:14:24 PM (GMT-7)

Thanks Old Hat! :p