Gluten? Does it get a bad wrap? - discusion

I'm just posting things that may lead to something
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10805569
books.google.com/books?id=Gj69kVpgWiEC&pg=PA15&lpg=PA15&dq=tyrosine+aspergillus&source=bl&ots=amIFqe1wSM&sig=oJUM7lH2-olgJGJR90kzq43rFYg&hl=en&sa=X&ei=4ZFNUpKaOsfziQKJ74GQBw&ved=0CC0Q6AEwATgK#v=onepage&q=tyrosine%20aspergillus&f=false

OM/Path - Pleas read bellow

I came across this: www.dynamiclist.com/export/static_html.aspx?node=53687436-2e3a-4aec-9f29-cc878ce9974d Says sour dough is the worst but who really knows. - not what I was driving at, just had a lot of info... and studies...

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This thread took an odd twist here, I doubt it's a root cause (mould/fungi) as you say OM, but maybe we're just highly susceptible due to a faulty mucus barrier type thing. Or combo of effects etc. And this causes us some serious troubles.

OM, I want to make a post on your Air Quality Thread about mold/viruses and UV treatment and how to really apply these filtration methods with success in room air cleaners (no systems really do currently), but I also need to explain something about combustion byproducts to do so properly. So it's another long explanation - but in a nutshell low temperature combustion from alternative (biomass/oils) and diesel fuel sources create incomplete combustion byproducts (organic molecules mostly carbon based) and aerosols present due to the lower temperature combine. Its all pretty complicated to type out but it's called nucleation - or this is really the first step. about 30% of the "stuff" in the ambient air is mold spores/viruses and so on. What happens is these carbon type organic molecules are like ummm Velcro (due to their surface properties) and when they bang against mold, bacteria etc they combine into larger particles due to a force called (van der Waals force) and direct adhesive forces in the case of aerosols. The smaller the particles the greater the force, the stronger the bond sort of thing. They basically cannot be separated or pulled apart. Only captured. HEPPA again and number of air changes/CFM is #1 in this situation as well.

In areas exposed to high amounts of these - think anywhere they burn oil for fuel, coal for heating, oil (bitumin) for electrical power generation - THIS is the big one... Bitumen.. it produces gazillions of these organic carbon molecules and they attach to the organic biologicals in the air (mold, bacteria etc) due to the reason above. When we uptake them through breathing, our bodies cannot really deal with them all that well for a bunch or reasons and again they end up deposited in our distal colon eventually.

Canada - of course (go figure) is big on Bitumen power plants (due to our oil sands/general oil supply) and I think we lead the world in IBD incidence and same with China for Bitumen (don't forget they skew their health stats as well) and we have such a high incidence of IBD... more so it was Alberta that was leading the IBD incidence up until the day Newbrunswick fired up their plants using Bitumen and WHAMMO - They now lead the way in incidence in Canada: In the late 1990s, NB Power signs a supply contract with PDVSA for Orimulsion, a cheap bitumen-based fuel, for its Coleson Cove and Belledune facilities. They get super concentrated effects of this because or their geographic size and population clustering. Really I think it's now all eastern Provinces. So Nova Scotia, New Brunswick etc.

This has happened elsewhere as well - Sweden... and specific areas that switched to all diesel and low temperature biomass fuels - they shoot up in IBD incidence...

Until today and the whole mycotoxin/mold/fungi as an alternative to gluten being the issue thing I never gave much thought to this whole process - (carbon/bio particle agglomeration). I was always interested in the carbon/combustion particle being the worst offender on its own.. this may not be the case. It's not something that generates a lot of interest except in weird people like me and Professor Tan. Its such a peculiar process though so I find it fascinating.

This of of such high interest to me because it's something that I could actively participate in and contribute to, actually obtain funding for, and participate in research in combo with the University and government funding - Instead of just sitting here reading about crap and not being able to really do anything... I have other current related projects on the go anyway that this falls into. The University has a new Health Sciences department that would jump on this in a heartbeat as well.

I would just need to find out a little about airborne mycotoxins, mycotoxin effects on the body and how we deal with them naturally, what would prevent us from dealing with them (i.e carbon bonds etc), and well anything else that may be even remotely related like health effects on the body and such to make a case to submit for funding... and Professor Tan would be all over this in a heart beat. I will be speaking with him tonight for sure.

Maybe you guys can make a mental note and post anything you can come across in your travels that might be remotely related. Like a separate thread just full of papers. Like incidence papers on air quality and IBD/autoimmune and well anything you can think of..

Again I'm not suggesting cause - but there's ample here to possibly explain a very logical and scientific "Westernization" aspect through this process if somehow we are made more susceptible or something (faulty mucus barrier/breakdown in mucus barrier). Also if there's any relief from symptoms from filtration I'd be making the perfect system for everyone on the board here and giving them away so fast it would be crazy!...

Post Edited (Canada Mark) : 10/3/2013 1:38:25 PM (GMT-6)

Do you know that aspergillus is used in biomass formation to absorb heavy metals?
www.pakbs.org/pjbot/PDFs/43(1)/PJB43(1)419.pdf. I know I'm humping aspergillus here but the stuff appears to be in my ear and blood. I think it sequesters heavy metal, effects one carbon metabolism and is a serious issue for immune compromised people. People with UC are immune compromised. I think once it takes a foothold it exhausts the immune system and is incredibly hard to get rid of. I think when we eat these contaminated grains or are exposed to it in significant quantities in our environment our immune system overreacts. That's what they say is the issue with ibd, immune overreaction. For me, I think it seeds my intestine via postnatal drip. My immune system might be able to fight normal exposure if not constantly exposed. For now, I think I must figure out how to reduce the biofilm, remove the metals and attack this systemic fungal issue. Until I do then I'm open to every pathogen.. Lyme mycoplasma, viruses...fungus is the doorway that holds the door open for everything else. This is my theory.

Good link, Canadamark. I thought the mold people were kinda crazy till lately. I'm starting to become a believer.

I don't know. I think it kills them.. Side note.. I saw this in the hammecher catalog
www.hammacher.com/Product/Default.aspx?sku=81655&promo=Home-Living-Air-Quality&catid=1719. So according to that, heat does kill them. I debated buying it but saw it during the summer and felt like it would heat up the house.. Now that fall is here I'm contemplating..

I'd save your money

Convective flow is slow... super slow. So there is zero chance it will effect an actual room.

Test chambers are like 2 feet cubed, so of course it may show effectiveness in a lab setting but scale it and zero effectiveness will occur. Like that Orek guy and his little box of smoke on the infomercials. Such a total scam! I hate that guy so much it's crazy. Old people buy his little system cause he's old and they believe him, and well there's nothing I hate more than people taking advantage of old people... he should be... well... I'll stop there before I get madder.

And there's no filters! One thing we have learned from OM posts is that even "dead" bacteria can cause a reaction. Both good and bad bacteria. In fact I recall a recent one I think he posted where they are testing using just part of the bacterial cell wall from anaerobic bacteria to provide the same benefits as FT without the need for real poop or complex/impossible culturing. This was a pretty cool idea I thought. If it works...

Anyway that's a perfect example of gimicky stuff in the air quality industry that just sucks cash out of people pockets like some of the supplement places do to us. Just trying to be honest is all...

Yes dead bacteria dna can cause immune response.'
Mycotoxins believe are heat stable.
That study from Sweden is on here somewhere but have no idea where.

My dad grew up in Monessen Pa,we used to visit my grandfather when I was a kid, US steel was down the street,

whole town used to stink non stop, Bessemer converters, coal fired,thick fog smoke pollution. My grandfather,real tuff guy, worked in that steel mill 51 years, made it to 96. No one in the family that I know about had IBD, but they did not talk about this stuff back then, so who knows. I don't think anyone had it, they did not look sick.
Om

Post Edited (Old Mike) : 10/3/2013 8:47:25 PM (GMT-6)

Smoking I still do on purpose while I am not in remsission,it probably helps.
I quit in july for 3 weeks, cold turkey. Well the mouth ulcers were so bad could not hardly talk or eat.
had to restart. Next time I quite will taper down so it is not so bad.
There is no question smoking suppresses immune system,mine went wild.
Quit 1977, UC 1980,restart 1982 UC remission.
Quit again 1986 flare, and am still in the same dam flare.'
OM

I go to Starbucks, where at the end of the day they give me all their coffee grinds from the day, and i mix them in for the rose bushes. Roses love them, but after a day the amount of mold is just crazy. It's smelly mold to. I wonder what the incidence is compared to coffee consumption from 1930 haha.

I would assume mold/fungus has been around since bacteria basically and would be pretty smart and crafty as well. Though we've been dealing with them naturally just fine since. But now that I think about it I see it everywhere. I even noticed it in the corner of my shower this morning. (unless it was dirt).

It would make sense that our GI system would be completely full of them as well, probably more so then we are aware of. Thrush kicks in pretty darn fast when we take antibiotics so bacteria are obviously doing a major job in keeping them in check...

Actually based on how quickly they develop, after say antibiotics I would say they are highly opportunistic.

In any case yet another reason to fix the mucus barrier. Perhaps the mucus is also anti-fungal in some way, not just anti-bacterial. Or perhaps just the size of them or their mycotoxins... without the thick sulfur type mucus maybe they pass right through our natural barrier that normally would flush them out or something.

Here is the snipped on Sour Dough Bread: Source:www.dynamiclist.com/export/static_html.aspx?node=53687436-2e3a-4aec-9f29-cc878ce9974d
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Breads Sourdoughs are the worst (sometimes labeled yeast-free), such as pumpernickle, coffee cakes and other foods made with large amounts of yeast. Bread develops surface mold after a day. Tortillas, biscuits, muffins, cakes and cookies are yeast-free. Dough conditioners are moldy.

Kind of a sketchy source though so I don't know.

Ok - this is a weird thought - but I also mix Activated Charcoal in with the coffee grounds and mix it in the soil around the roots of each Rose Bush... They shoot up and bloom like there's no tomorrow.. This is because a) I have over a 1,000 lbs of it that I use to work with at the shop for filtering (I had to buy it in bulk) for filtration testing and stuff.

and b) because the carbon does a few things. It provides a huge surface area for the bacteria, soil nutrients and such to bond to as well as CO2 from the air in the soil for the uptake from the roots. And I'm pretty sure it changes the bacterial make-up of the soil itself. I read this part in a farming book somewhere. Anyway - the carbon is essentially the same as what's found in the air from pollution via combustion.

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In any case it is interesting that perhaps it's not the gluten we're so sensitive to... And regardless, dealing with it seems like it would lead or point to the mucus barrier.

Maybe it would be worth making a list or column of foods that effect saliomcus and sulfur mucus and then trying to build a trial diet for a few days eating only foods under the sulfur mucus column as best or as much as possible and see if there's any effect.

I found a study that says several essential oils kill aspergillus in particular, the ones that don't kill it neutralize its ability to produce mycotoxins.

Activated charcoal binds mycotoxins. Dr. Shoemaker, mr mold doc, uses cholestramine as an integral part of his program to bind the mycotoxins. It essentiall binds cholesterol.

Lemme see if I can find that do study.

Here it is
www.ajol.info/index.php/ajb/article/download/79702/69978

How long? This stuff takes time. No offense but if anything I've learned that it takes way more time then I thought.