Prednisone without the side effects? Holy crap...

Well worth a watch...

This is on the Crohn's Infection Website but a) it's fascinating b) it's also a very sad story in a way and c) I can't help but think of all those with Ulcerative Colitis that Pred helps. Imagine being able to accomplish the same without the side effects.

thecrohnsinfection.org/symposium-information/
Click on Emerging Crohns Medical Treatments | Dr William Chamberlin - It is the presentation on a drug called Fepibro.

I wonder what else (drugs) are out there that have fallen through the cracks and will never see the light of day for similar reasons.....

Irishgal1 who is currently taking the anti-MAP triple antibiotic therapy and doing awesome posted the link to the video of the Crohn's Board.

Since my name was mentioned here is some info.

Old Mike

http://thecrohnsinfection.org/dr-william-chamberlin-fepibro/

here is what the compound is 16-bromoepiandrosterone

http://thecrohnsinfection.org/dr-william-chamberlin/

it is an analog of DHEA, DHEA and DHEA-S are elevated in babies and seems to decrease in adulthood,

but it varies with age

that's what I gather from this paper, read last paragraph.

http://aac.asm.org/content/46/10/3180.full.pdf

Come to think of it I was taking DHEA at least 20 years ago, orally for immune modulation

you can still buy it and it is cheap,

http://www.lifeextension.com/Protocols/Metabolic-Health/Dhea-Restoration/Page-01

dhea cream may work better,not sure I would use it rectally

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2011/03/19/the-most-common-mistakes-in-bioidentical-hormone-replacement.aspx

the bromo form is synthetic.

But now also have to wonder about low dietary bromine levels in these diseases.

looks like bromine might be essential for collagen type IV, to make basement membranes

if you remember Pravdas paper, one of the first things to go in UC is the basement membrane

http://blog.zrtlab.com/bromine-an-essential-element

DHEA IBD trial

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12562454

cant find anymore trials on dhea, makes you wonder if cheap treatments work,then follow up

somehow gets killed off. Also remember that in this trial these people were refractory to meds.

Then I have to wonder if plain old DHEA might also be having and effect on MAP like the bromo version.

When I took it pretty sure was not using 200mg.

dhea and TB

http://intimm.oxfordjournals.org/content/early/2013/02/22/intimm.dxt004.full.pdf

 

Post Edited (Old Mike) : 9/30/2015 2:42:51 AM (GMT-6)

The recent increased research on MAP and autoimmune diseases is a good thing. The debate is 100 years old, but the research was not possible until recently when methods to test for MAP with genetic markers were developed.

There seems to be a lot of research, so it is not clear how some assert that there is not enough. There is also some autoimmune components still part of the puzzle (for example having antibodies to variants of human collagen), and some CD cases that do not fit MAP hypothesis at all.

The prospective vaccine trial will be interesting. Further light on MAP and immune deficiency and autoimmune and genetics ... etc, will lead to breakthroughs.

Fascinating! Thanks OM.

Mayo has listed recommended dose rates of DHEA here http://www.mayoclinic.org/drugs-supplements/dhea/dosing/hrb-20059173

Base on those recommendations I have decided to order 100 mg X 60 caps here http://www.amazon.com/DHEA-100-mg-60-Caps/dp/B0017O5REC/ref=sr_1_3?s=hpc&ie=UTF8&qid=1443116522&sr=1-3&keywords=DHEA

Interesting - thanks OM,

Turns out there is a few recent studies on DHEA and positive effects on tuberculosis in AIDS patients as well. Aside from that there is a few studies on those supplementing with DHEA while on Prednisone and suggesting it helps alleviate some of the side effects like bone density and immune function - perhaps similar to what AguywithUC describes.

Perhaps their 'analog' is basically a more direct and potent version. A slight difference in chemical structure etc can have profound differences in effects.

I think I'd like to try it, as you say, the cheap version... but the kicker is that it's prescription only here in Canada it seems. I'll have to see if I can make a case for my family doctor. I actually think it might be worth a try.

-----

Was interesting:
"As suggested by the evidence depicted above, DHEA seems to have two different functions regarding immune modulation: it favors Th1 responses, fundamental in the protection against intracellular pathogens like Mtb and HIV, and, on the other hand, it exerts anti-inflammatory actions, which may be beneficial in the context of chronic infection. For that reason, DHEA has been proved as an adjuvant therapy for the treatment of several infectious diseases." www.hindawi.com/journals/bmri/2015/461093/

Post Edited (Canada Mark) : 9/24/2015 5:23:35 PM (GMT-6)

I found this as well which explains some things: umm.edu/health/medical/altmed/supplement/dehydroepiandrosterone

Turns out there is a test you can get to find out if your levels are low. I'd probably get a test if it is available. There is also a very new study that states that mycobacterial 'antigens' alone lower DHEA levels as part of the infection process. And this link mentions the study were a few Ulcerative Colitis patients went into remission from it but point out it was not all that well designed.

On the Crohn's board I asked irishgal1 to ask Dr. Chamberlin (Fepibro) if he thought this might be a valid option until such time as their version is made. Will wait to hear back on that before anything. Maybe I'll ask dr. Zhang or one of the others as well in the mean time. Just curious.