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Antibiotics allow gut pathogens to 'breathe'

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Posted 5/4/2016 1:16 AM (GMT 0)
"The chain of events that occur within the gut lumen after antibiotic treatment that allow 'bad' bugs to flourish is now better understood, thanks to new research."

/www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/05/160502215707.htm

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I kinda though this was understood already. But I didn't know that colonic epithelial cells required butyrate to absorb water....... I have never head or read of this before.


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Real paper:
www.cell.com/cell-host-microbe/abstract/S1931-3128(16)30096-8?_returnURL=http%3A%2F%2Flinkinghub.elsevier.com%2Fretrieve%2Fpii%2FS1931312816300968%3Fshowall%3Dtrue

Anyone head of tributyrin before ?? See the above paper. Might be worth looking into.

Post Edited (Canada Mark) : 5/3/2016 7:20:06 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/4/2016 9:31 AM (GMT 0)
I've often wondered if IBD isn't cause by an environmentally triggered loss of some unidentified beneficial bacteria the absence of which allows more problematic bacteria to thrive, which then causes the chain of immune response we all struggle with. Which problematic bacteria proliferates might account for the differences in people's IBD. The problem with this theory, of course, is given the huge number of bacteria in our guts, I don't see how they could ever figure out which specific one is missing.

As for tributyrin, it's in butter. Butter has always agreed with me. Might need to start eating some sort of crazed butter/clove combo to increase my clostridia...

Post Edited (FSLondon) : 5/4/2016 3:37:06 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/4/2016 11:14 AM (GMT 0)
Oh boy finally a possible mechanism for why some get UC after antibiotics,besides just killing off bacteria.
I have at least one big thread on what is going on with inflammation and ROS changing
the oxygen tension in the colon which then can shift the bacteria populations from strict anaerobes,
to facultative anaerobes, or more oxygen requiring bacteria.
Perhaps in my Pravada thread.
Old Mike

all of Pravada patents
patents.justia.com/inventor/jay-pravda

Post Edited (Old Mike) : 5/4/2016 5:29:40 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/4/2016 2:45 PM (GMT 0)
I was diagnosed with UC after a year of constant antibiotic use from sinus infections.

I now have had bronchitis for over a month now and I am staring at my antibiotic bottle wondering if it is time to give in. You just reminded me why I would rather have bronchitis than another UC flare. thanks for posting.
Posted 5/4/2016 10:07 PM (GMT 0)
Interesting on the butter London. I think I recall someone posting about Ghee a while ago... that is butter. I can't remember if it was a positive or negative response.

@OM - There is an old Science Daily article from maybe 2 years ago that spoke of this very thing as well. I will have to dig through some seriously buried bookmarks, but I remember a cyclical image with oxidation and a change from anaerobic to aerobic written in a white board. The whole short article had to do with the change from aerobic to aerobic conditions in the colon - which then allowed various e-coli to thrive for the same reasons, and this in turn drove things farther with oxidation issues in the cyclical pattern.

If there is a chemical (pharmaceutical) compound for trybutiryn, there must be some pharmaceutical anti-oxidants. The combo of the two things might help change/revert conditions in the colon.
Posted 5/4/2016 10:17 PM (GMT 0)
Mark:Here is some stuff no supplement though as far as I know, what we want perhaps in the
colon are reducing agents, of which hydrogen sulfide is one, producing the sulfur farts, but
perhaps even though toxic in high concentration or not detoxified, it is a last ditch effort
by the colon to save itself. It is just a tri ester of glycerol with butyric acid. I have tried eating
like a half a stick of butter a day in the past, to get more of this into me. No dice.
I guess I will go to a dried prune a day and see what happens if I can find no sulfite ones
in the store. But might suspect most dried fruit might act the same way, but since these are real
dark might contain more polyphenols.
Old Mike

/en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tributyrin

Mice UC
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22906779

Post Edited (Old Mike) : 5/4/2016 4:23:08 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/4/2016 10:30 PM (GMT 0)
Scientists find key to growth of 'bad' bacteria in inflammatory bowel disease
/www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/02/130207172102.htm

Above is the article I was thinking of.

So something along these lines for antibiotic induced IBD - The antibiotics change the bacterial make-up as per the first article. Then this allows bad (inflammatory) bacteria that are aerotollerant to thrive, and the inflammatory response to these facultative anaerobic and aerobic bacteria further fuels the fire by allowing e-coli and such to thrive via utilization of a new and plentiful food source (nitrates) as in the above. E-coli are facultative anaerobic bacteria.

Even the MAP antibody studies showed UC patients had high antibody response to e-coli and one other facultative anaerobe... I;d have to dig that one out as well.

Anyway. The two articles combined makes one think...
Posted 5/4/2016 10:35 PM (GMT 0)
Now that I think of it, I wonder if the sulfur type farts are actually the response of nitrate utilization...

You can duplicate the very same smell by using cheap protein powder which contains fillers. The fillers are always cheap, high nitrogen content amino acids.

Post Edited (Canada Mark) : 5/4/2016 4:39:33 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/4/2016 11:12 PM (GMT 0)
Well we know iNOS is a bad actor, I have also mentioned many times that if I supplement
with arginine a precursor to NO via inos I get worse. All part of the increased oxygen tension
in the colon changing/killing off of the strict anaerobes.
Old Mike
Posted 5/5/2016 1:09 AM (GMT 0)
I wonder if any of his treatment ideas have been tired? The enema preparations. He sure has a lot of them. You should maybe write to him and ask.
Posted 5/5/2016 1:24 AM (GMT 0)
I think Pravda ran one but I can get my link to work anymore, but you can look at my
radical induction theory a time to revisit thread.
Here is another trial based on his theory. I have taken lots of NAC and or curcumin, believe curcumin
was doing me some good but really thins my blood, I even posted about bleeding all over the place
from a small cut about 2 months ago.
OM
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2710726/

Mark really think you will like this paper on CD by Pravda not sure if I posted it in the past.

Crohn’s disease: Evidence for involvement of unregulated transcytosis in disease etio-pathogenesis

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3070014/

Post Edited (Old Mike) : 5/4/2016 7:34:30 PM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/5/2016 2:08 AM (GMT 0)
Hahaha... I totally just finished reading that and logged on to post it for you saying the same thing!

I left my computer for a bit and when I came back his LinkedIn profile was on my screen and as I scrolled down I ran into it.

I think I'll forward that one onto John. That was a very good read. Remember (or maybe I did not post it) but Dr. Zhang made a recent post where he said that for some reason in Crohn's patients they are detecting a lot of antigens and bacterial DNA in the blood and he said he suspected that means there is a barrier issue at the root of the disease.
Posted 5/5/2016 2:18 AM (GMT 0)
Have you come across this yet: ?

"CEO: Jay Pravda, M.D., M.P.H., is a practicing immunologist who was in private practice for 23 years before embarking on a new career re-examining poorly served diseases that are misclassified. He published the "Radical induction theory of ulcerative colitis" in 2005 (World J. Gastroenterol 2005 April;11(16):2371-2384) and developed a new therapy for Ulcerative Colitis based on this theory that is now in clinical development. Initial clinical experience has been remarkable: "all of those administered the novel treatment alone achieved clinical remission within six weeks of treatment".

Source: therashock.com/the-team.html

I'm trying to figure out what the heck his 'New Ulcerative Colitis Therapy' is......


EDIT: Six weeks is insane... if it holds true. How amazing would that be for everyone with UC.
Posted 5/5/2016 2:47 AM (GMT 0)
Found this, but I think I recall you posting about it a long time ago when you first came across the Radical Induction thing. Anyway, it seems you need a subscription to read it.

Small Trial Evaluates New Disease Paradigm, Treatment for Ulcerative Colitis
Researchers say they have developed a new treatment that effectively targets the underlying cause of ulcerative colitis, based on a case series of 33 patients with mild to moderate UC. Nearly all patients in the study experienced rapid and sustained clinical, endoscopic and histologic remission.
In the News | POST DATE: OCTOBER 11, 2012
Posted 5/5/2016 9:55 AM (GMT 0)
Was really hard to dig out, this is a digital addition article starts on page 22. You can adjust
page size with the slider on the left. Pravda clinical trial.
OM

/issuu.com/mcmahongroup/docs/mmge0010_2012_web
Posted 5/6/2016 12:58 AM (GMT 0)
That is really interesting - I wonder if they have done any follow up studies since. It seems he shifted focus to Sepsis. Hope that doesn't leave the UC thing buried. Sepsis is such a huge market - far more than I realized. Dr. Zhang is also interested in the sepsis market.
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