High-fiber diet keeps gut microbes from eating colon's lining, protects against infection

Just came out quite interesting.
Old Mike
medicalxpress.com/news/2016-11-high-fiber-diet-gut-microbes-colon.html

might also tie into why UC mostly starts in the rectum, by the time the stool gets to the rectum
all the fiber is eaten, then the critters get hungry, then they eat and erode the mucus layer, then they
invade.

now if we all only could tolerate a lot of fiber

cant seem to find the whole article yet.
been looking for ways to stop the little buggers from eating too much mucus
of course vegetarians get UC so not the whole story.

Post Edited (Old Mike) : 11/17/2016 11:01:48 AM (GMT-7)

"The result: the mucus layer stayed thick, and the infection didn't take full hold, in mice that received a diet that was about 15 percent fiber from minimally processed grains and plants. But when the researchers substituted a diet with no fiber in it, even for a few days, some of the microbes in their guts began to munch on the mucus."

So we're talking some fiber, but I don't have to start swallowing cup after cup of breadcrumbs and empty the whole container in one sitting. I'd think normal meals with some vegetables and breads or other fibers would be just fine

Sara: Yep like I said not the whole story, and vegans of course get UC.
Perhaps the fiber is depleted well before the stool gets to the rectum,even
if eating a vegan diet.

I hope they give you the right meds to kill off the c diff.
OM

I thought I would add in fiber types and how they ferment.
One problem I see is that can you make more bacteria, by feeding them.
Besides all the gas, distension, and such going on.

I have tried eating a lot of bran and fiber does not work out well.
Bran flakes and such. Whether it is increased bacteria or gut wall irritation don't know.
OM

www.nature.com/ajg/journal/v108/n5/full/ajg201363a.html

Post Edited (Old Mike) : 11/18/2016 8:21:25 AM (GMT-7)

A leaky gut for one reason or another may account for vegans with UC?

i keep trying to add fiber but my colon just rages at it, it is just impossible in my case (:

good thing we all spend a great deal of time researching around here !

why on earth would anyone thing think that they should do research on chick peas of all things ? have they pretty much run out of other ideas ?

Soystud:
Chickpeas, lots of fiber, location of digestion in the colon, bacterial populations that might expand or contract, production of different short chain fatty acid, ratios.
Who knows, what else.

Old Mike

btw OM, howz the kid doing ?

Talking of mucous, saw this one this week

/www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/12/161208085856.htm

Newly discovered bacteria-binding protein in the intestine

"In the study from Sahlgrenska Academy, researchers have addressed the key role of the bacteria-binding protein ZG16 in protecting the body from intestinal bacteria...............The new research shows that the protein ZG16 binds and clumps bacteria together and thus works with the protective mucus layer in the intestine to keep bacteria at a safe distance from the intestinal mucosa.

Mice that lack the protein develop a mucus layer that is more permeable to bacteria, allowing more bacteria to cross the intestinal mucosa into the body. The increased quantity of bacteria that reach the body's various tissues cause low-grade inflammation"

but the research I posted has nothing to do with auto-immunity, it's a suggestion as to what might make the mucous barrier more permeable. Put that together with the other research that started this thread on mucin degrading bacteria and you've got reasons for the barrier to be permeated and then the invasion begins. The research from Germany that was discussed a lot on here a while back using the new methods to image bacteria that had broken through the mucous layers demonstrates what was not understood for a long time, that bacteria etc do settle under the mucous layer once it is broken.

So as people like Dr Rubin from Chicago are now saying - this seems more an immune-mediated than an auto-immune disease. i.e. the immune system is constantly trying to kill something that is not where it should be. Whether or not this is because of an unseen pathogen or just your common e coli etc getting through into places that are only just being able to be imaged is unknown. Do those who don't develop IBD have a body that doesn't go after the pathogen or do they have a stronger mucous layer that never gets broken, that seems important to know to understand why two people living the same lifestyle/eating the same food don't necessarily both develop IBD.

As far as MAP, it is certainly interesting that IBD genetic research is showing common genes with those with susceptibility to TB and leprosy.

With stress, it's a red herring really I think. Human life has always been stressful, more so in the past really. However, when we are stressed we likely do a lot of things that helps IBD proliferate - less exercise, less sun, more convenience food and, as you say,stress does deplete vitamins etc that we are often short on in the first place.