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Mixed medications for high blood pressure

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Posted 10/7/2006 2:16 AM (GMT 0)

Dear friends,

This is my first foray on this chat room and I hope that perhaps others have had some experience with using multiple medications to treat high blood pressure.

I developed a rapid heart rate about 15 years ago and have been taking Tenormin beta-blocker (Atenolol) ever since.  Over the years my dosage went from 25mg to 50mg to 25mg and back to 50mg. 

about a year ago I developed some headache and light headedness.  My blood pressure was not changing properly from the lay down resting position, back up to the standing position.  We slowly reduced the Atenolol from 50mg to 25mg but then my blood pressure jumped up.  After this whole episode I finally stabilized back again at 50mg of Atenolol but needed to add 25mg of Hydrochlorothiazide.

Well now, a year later, my blood pressure was once again climbing so my doctor added Avapro 150mg. 

Now I am taking these three medications and have the headaches back again. 

I think this is getting out of hand and my doctors have no clue really on how best to help me.

Does anyone take these three (Atenolol, hydrochlorothiazide and Avapro) mediations together?  Any side affects or bad experiences to look out for?

Thanks, John

Posted 10/7/2006 12:01 PM (GMT 0)

John,

As I am a newcomer here too!

Just looking at your post it looks like your doctor does not really know..

What tests have you had in the past to establish the condition your being treated for?

Cause I went a cardolologist the other day and he mentioned hormone problems causes rappied heart beat... Have you had your thyroid levels looked at? And even your blood Sugar levels?

Posted 10/11/2006 2:22 AM (GMT 0)

Greetings to UK Lyme Suffer,

 

Thanks for your inquiry.

 

I recently had another blood test and except for my Cholesterol, all of the counts (including Thyroid) are in the acceptable range.

 

In the past I have had cardio stress tests, regular 48-hour heart monitoring, EKG's, a battery of blood tests, echocardiograms, etc.  I went to the Cleveland Clinic heart center about five years ago for a workup and they found nothing either.

 

There is some component of high blood pressure, but a rapid heart beat is the underlying symptom.

 

I am going back in another week for a cat scan and maybe more blood sugar tests (although the last one 6-months back was still (barely) in the normal range.  If my triglycerides get too high, that prompts the blood sugar level to increase also.

 

Thanks, John

 

Posted 10/11/2006 8:04 AM (GMT 0)
John,

I am thinking of asking one of these labs that do allergy testing, on the blood and foods; if they might do allergy test on drugs and herbs I might need to take..

That might be an idea for you to look at?
Cause I`ve just tried a herb mix for diabetes combined with the high blood pressure capsule my doctor prescibed.... My heart rate fell too much for a few days so I came off the high blood pressure capsule and the blood pressure went up... (I noticed I did get a senstivity to salt and fats for a few days even though I don`t eat much) Somethings trigger a mini stroke?
My cholestrol has been within normal limits at testing, what it does in between?
But I usually remain quite low as I don`t eat much fat.
Because of the diabetes and other homones I`ve been salt loosing, so perhaps had to take extra sometimes.
Posted 10/11/2006 8:27 PM (GMT 0)
John,

I am not taking the exact same meds as you are, however, I am taking a beta-blocker (Toprol XL) and Hyzaar, which contains hydrochlorothiazide. Are you taking any other meds that may have an impact on it's effectiveness? The reason I say this is because a few years back, I was taking a pain medication containing an anti-inflammatory and my pressure began rising. I am not 100% sure if it was that particular drug itself-it has been pulled off the market since, but I now avoid anti-inflammatories and use Tylenol when necessary.

Again, I am not positive about this but if this could possibly have some effect in your situation, perhaps you could try and see if it makes any difference. It really does take a while to zero in on blood pressure medications and from time to time, you may need to be adjusted. My husband takes three and it took a while until they were satisfied with the results. We both are monitered by our physicans and also take our pressure at home. I think it takes a while for your body to even get used to the medication. I remember being dizzy and once my hubby ended up on the floor.(that was scary) He is diabetic and we were a little unsure about what was happening so I took his bp and sure enough, it was extremely low. We did learn that you should never "jump up" when you're reclining or you can have a sudden drop like that.
Posted 10/11/2006 10:59 PM (GMT 0)
Hi John, how high is your bp with all the meds.  my sis had hers running 160/90 and she has been on 50mg of atenolol. they added another and she had swelling that was horrible, it seems to me you are on an awful lot of meds for one issue, could you consider changing to an ace inhibitor or another beta blocker besides the one you are on. sometiomes i am glad i do not tolerate meds well, drs. are forced to not overmed me. good luck

Posted 10/15/2006 3:43 AM (GMT 0)

Greetings to UK Lyme Suffera, Foggie and Dreamgirl,

 

Thanks for your comments. 

 

Right now I am taking three meds for my high blood pressure.  They are Atenolol (50mg), Hydrochlorothiazide (25mg) and Avapro (150mg).  I also take Zetia for Cholesterol control.

 

But something is still radically happening.  I have had headaches, hot flashes, and some itching for the past 2+ months.  It feels as if I am allergic to something.

 

I had these symptoms a year ago and at that time my doctor actually reduced my Atenolol because my blood pressure was not behaving normally.  I was in the normal range (130/80) but it was not changing properly when I layed down and then stood up.  I had the headaches then.  So the doc gradually reduced my Atenolol from 50mg to 25 mg and I actually felt great for about 4 days.  Then my blood pressure shot up (190/110) and the Atenolol went back to 50mg plus the addition of Hydrochlorothiazide 25 mg just to get stabilized.  But the headaches did end.  Well, that did stabilize me and I was OK with those two meds for about a year. 

 

about two months ago I was outside during the 95 degree heat and it was too much.  My blood pressure went out of control and after about two weeks of that the headaches and the other symptoms described above started, and have continued ever since.

 

I have discontinued the use of Avapro for about 1-week now.  We are trying to see if that new medication has anything to do with this.  I originally thought that it did, but I have my doubts now as the headaches and symptoms still persist, although not as sever.

 

The doc thinks that something else (??) is happening that causes this.  We did some blood tests and they all came back within acceptable range, except my cholesterol 199, triglycerides 311 and blood sugar of 100 (99 is the acceptable range limit).  But as long as I can control the triglycerides my sugar stays low and is not a concern.  They went up from my last test 3-months ago because with these problems I have not been able to exercise.

 

On Monday I am going for a CAT scan.

 

Thanks everyone for your comments and suggestions.  

 

- John



 

Posted 10/15/2006 11:30 AM (GMT 0)

John,

The adreanl/pituitary system has a lot to answer for it might be worth you while looking for a lab that does saliva tests in which you can test the hormone level over a day..

Several hormones can be tested for... Cause a spot blood test does not really show what your doing?

I had one or two done about 10 year ago it showed I had a low morning cortisol what they called a maladaption cycle... But the consultants in endocrineology refused to recognise them...

Hopefully they are more up to speed now days. But the old doc`s are still just hanging on with their old ideas???

One of the GP`s at my practice, said he believe my cortisol level was not right.. The otherday so I`ve dug up these tests and will hand them in.. See if he has a suggestion...

Though if your cortisol system is effected, it could mean seriods on top of everything else.... Or the glands being removed if they are overactive, then supplimented with steriods...

I`ve been looking at the herbal equvient but, your average herbalist is not really up to speed. The ginseng herbs which is a number of different herbs are said to work for both high and low blood pressure as well as help with natural cortisol. If you can experiment, you might find you only need a periodic course.

But its on your own oness... eyes

Posted 10/22/2006 6:28 PM (GMT 0)

Greetings to UK Lyme Suffer,

 

Thanks for the tip about checking the adrenal/pituitary system.  I will see what I can find out about this.

 

My blood pressure is doing well without the Avapro right now.  My system seems to have settled down a bit - so back to only the two med (Atenolol and Hydrochlorothiazide) each day.

 

The CT scan came back normal

… but I failed (not by much) the glucose test.  For the following day I felt symptoms of diabetes.

 

The day of that test (146 mg/dl) I experienced some of the symptoms of diabetes and it was not pleasant.  So now my doctor wants me to monitor the blood sugar level for the next month before deciding what to do.

 

For the first two days following the test my numbers were in the normal range (<100 mg/dl).  Perhaps I am border line, but we will see over the next few weeks.

The doctor is now talking about metabolic syndrome.  Have you ever heard of this?  Some malfunction of the metabolism maybe causing this.  Would the adrenal/pituitary testing help to shed some light here?  


But the headaches are still here, although not as strong.    I probably need to wait a few more weeks before drawing any conclusions about Avapro contributing to the problem.

Thanks, John

  

Posted 10/22/2006 9:35 PM (GMT 0)

Well John,

I`ve been looking how diabetes as such is not just insulin; be that insulin resistance as in type 2 or deficient as in type1..

You know how the experts keep trying to tell us we are eating the wrong food for heart disease and diabetes.. The truth its genetics, not much to do with the food or I think the excercise.. Our genetics could have been altered by pollution our dear government have allowed industry to do with our food and air.. Along with armed forces..

Putting that aside what can we do to help ourselves?

I had a 24 hour urine sample test about 10 years ago for mixed cortisol. It show I had a high normal total cortisol.. I have a copy of the report and went through it with a fine tooth comb. Hange on a moment I said to the doctors looking at me, there are various cortisol/seriods missing on this report. They seemed out of their depth and really found it hard to admit. I was ignored by our NHS Endocrinologists whom I saw several+ others outside the health service.

I had two of these 24 hour samples done, but even the hospital lab staff said they thought things did not look right.. But it was up to the consultants..

To bring it up to date the main componets I found missing where 11 Hydroxe cortisol.. This links to a number of condition inculding congenitial adrenal hyproplasia.. But the endocrineologist refused to believe it could be.. The treatment was is seriods.. Much of these conditions that`s all there is.

But yesterday I reached infomation over load; 11 OH group deficiency are linked to diabetes and weight gain and also glucose-6-phospate deficiency (which is linked to way we deal with fats). http://content.febsjournal.org/cgi/content/full/268/15/4113  

Taking it a stage further I also looked at digestive emyzins not only of the stomac but the pancress which makes a number of hormons, problems over the whole system.. Insulin ristance is not only caused by the interaction of adrenalin and insulin, but other hormones/emyzine produced by the gut not working correctly amylase being one is supposed to break down sugars.It also deals with how the immune system protects us from infection and allergic reactions. But if there`s a defect the whole can be put out of place..

Digestive emyzine need to be added or stiumulated to correct apparent problems in the hormone system.. http://www.enzymessential.com/HTML/amylase.html 

DHEA levels likewise are all linked..

The lab should be looking at the antigen levels which give a much more accurate byass towards deficientcy.. While the chemical is byass toward normal to excess.. There`s a great deal of confusion, these tests date back to the 1950`s.. Yet the medicis are trapped, they don`t want to or seem to know how to interpet the results.. 

Doctors were supposed to be intuative in their dealings with patients..                                    But they seem to have lost this skill.

They order tests and expect those tests to reflexct the condition totally, assume that or kidd you that those tests are 100%.. Where as they should be relying on symptoms and signs. A few blood testing sites warn of this fact.. Some say they should not rely on the blood test, rather than the symptoms and signs, incase someone sues them.. So they would rather not treat you at all.

Its also quicker here in the UK to concentrate on blood, when the avarage consultation is about 8 mins.. How can you obseve your patient in that time? It has to be several 8 min. over weeks or months... One doctor said to me, most conditions get better on their own. They probably do however if your the one with the condition that does not?

Good Luck

Posted 10/23/2006 5:27 PM (GMT 0)
i think the hydro could be causing the headaches. Have you ever tried verapamil which if for bp and headache. Im on that now and its not working yet.
Posted 10/23/2006 7:18 PM (GMT 0)

John,

No I have not tried that one! I tried propranolo (Spelling not sure) about 10 years ago.. It made me halluciante after about 2 days.. I saw this saling ship floating by, and that gave me a headache I remember..

It over stiumulates the adrenal glands..

I`ve largely survived on hawthrone and garlic, but it really was not doing too much in the end.. So my GP persuied me to take Ramprin it seem to help for about 3 weeks or so.. I then took this herb mix called Caosu for diabetes the two combined made my blood pressure drop into me boots. Came off the Ramprin and it  shot up..

Possilby caused a stroke? Saw a consultant at the local hospital the other day.. He did not examin me just spoke to me.. He said If I had a scan it would have implications on my insurance????? I did not think they were so partantic in the UK.  Though I suppose if you have HIV or a genetic test there are insurance implications here for that.

My blood pressure does seem a bit better for the moment; It was falling.. Metformin might of brought it down a bit more..

I did read some doctors are giving it for prediabetic patients if they have a family history, more so if they have a weight problem.

In my case if a drug does not improve matters with 48 hours its unlikely its going to in the future. But people work at different rates.

    

Posted 10/24/2006 3:03 AM (GMT 0)

Greetings to UK Lyme Suffer and ttwarrior1,

Thanks for the good information that you have shared.

I was almost headache free today but I had a big lunch since I was very hungry and that pushed my glucose level to 102.  It had been in the 80’s and low 90’s for a few days.  Certainly not high by standards (70 – 100 is normal) but for me I did feel the affect.  My headache returned and I felt diabetic again.   

I am beginning to believe that the headaches are due to the diabetes and the corresponding symptoms. 

 

The changes in blood pressure that I experienced over the past several months are probably due to something else, and not the diabetes. I say this because when I took the diabetes test last week, and my count elevated to 146, my blood pressure did not move at all.  It has been about 125/85 this whole time.

 

Anyway, I am going through some psychological adjustment after learning about the diabetes diagnosis. I guess that I always thought about death for me at age 75+ due to a heart attack.  Well, since I am nearly 56 I did not expect this right now. 

 

But that is how life is.  It’s not necessarily what WE want. 

Thanks, John     

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